Topic: Pinch weld blackout before vehicle assembly?

[Linc]

This has been my experience, but I wondered if there was supporting data to explicitly say which cars get it. 

[J_Speegle]

Is there any evidence that states all cars or only some cars received the rocker blackout? If only some
is it only lighter colored cars?

Yes there is evidence of what was done at most factories and years

It was thought at one time all years and plants did not apply the pinch weld blackout  on dark colored cars but findings on many dark color cars (across the years and plants) have lead many of us to change that opinion as it can not longer be supported. At the same time, at a show, a dark colored car would likely not be deducted for not having pinch weld blacked out pinch weld and the related overspray - IMHO more so on early Dearborn and NJ cars.

[Bob Gaines]

Yes there is evidence of what was done at most factories and years

It was thought at one time all years and plants did not apply the pinch weld blackout  on dark colored cars but findings on many dark color cars (across the years and plants) have lead many of us to change that opinion as it can not longer be supported. At the same time, at a show, a dark colored car would likely not be deducted for not having pinch weld blacked out pinch weld and the related overspray - IMHO more so on early Dearborn and NJ cars.

+ 1 . Just to add a slight clarification to Jeff's post for those reading .Yes there is explicate instructions which can be seen in the assemblyline manuals but personal observations in the real world by many competent eyes contradict the instructions. There are many other examples of things that were meant to be done a certain way by Ford that were in fact not done exactly the expected way.  Reasonable judging takes these things into consideration given the circumstances. We are still learning and still evolving with a positive direction in mind.

[jwc66k]

Judging. I know it's difficult for an owner and for a judge. There are differences between years (65 and 66, 67 and 68, etc), differences in body styles, differences between plants, differences in months, differences in shifts, difference in workers - all this to be crunched into "judging". On this particular subject, there is no direct mention of "pinch weld" in MCA judging criteria that I can find. It's a "judgment" call in a general catch all statement. MCA supposedly judges Mustangs to a standard, but if one does not exist for a particular area, in this case pinch welds, how can you make a call? How can you say, white car - painted pinch weld, black car - no paint? Just because "you" know, how does an owner "know"? What ever conclusion that is made on this subject or any subject on this forum has absolutely no bearing on an MCA judge's decision, they have a judging sheet, not a laptop. It's nice information to know on what subjects are discussed. I usually check to see if my cars conform, but if it's not on the MCA judge's sheets, it don't count.
My conclusion - expand and modify the judging sheets, as if that suggestion hasn't already been tried.
Jim 

[carlite65]

pinchwelds are mentioned in undercarriage section....section B.

[Linc]

I would like to thank you all for taking your own time to answer my question and offer up information and advice. I have a 67 Dearborn Fastback that is Clearwater Aqua that I have owned for 30 years, so I really wondered if it would be consider a light colored car or not, and have the blacked out rockers. But there is more to my curiosity I must admit. I am a Fairlane Club of America Tech adviser and we have changed our judging substantially over the years looking for a model that closely aligns with the Mustang Club of American.  Most of our cars that are white absolutely have the blacked out rockers from 67-69, but other colors there is no set answer.  We do know that ALL Talladegas had blacked out rockers and they are not all light colored cars. But they do all have worked over rockers. Like the previous posted stated, when clear evidence is not available we must defer to what documentation the owner can supply to support its originality. For us, there is way to much of that going on because of our lack of knowledge. So again, thanks for your help and support as I attempt to keep my Mustang looking like it did when the factory manufactured it. And the additional insight I gain into other models produced by ford. 

[Richard P.]

pinchwelds are mentioned in undercarriage section....section B.

+ 1 It is definitely mentioned in the MCA Judging rules.

[jwc66k]

pinchwelds are mentioned in undercarriage section....section B.

"Mentioned" is not defining, and the reference is to overspray. Just by that simple word, all cars are required to have a painted pinch weld.
Jim

[J_Speegle]

........but if it's not on the MCA judge's sheets, it don't count.

Completely incorrect. Judges have been instructed many times that they are NOT limited by the judging written rules (read can take off for details not included).

The written rules are there as a description of some of the items to check in that section, major items, items that are often overlooked (rear reminder) or details that are new to the community.

As mentioned before the number of pages limits and keep MCA from including everything that should be looked at and evaluated in any section . We can't put a description for 10% of all the details, like what is pinchweld and any one judging for MCA in a concours class should know what it means - if not that is why we have teams not individuals judging IMHO

[J_Speegle]

............... We do know that ALL Talladegas had blacked out rockers and they are not all light colored cars. But they do all have worked over rockers. Like the previous posted stated, when clear evidence is not available we must defer to what documentation the owner can supply to support its originality. For us, there is way to much of that going on because of our lack of knowledge. .................

Will report that all of the Ranchero's and Torino's I've owned over the years (68-72) had blacked out pinch welds like the Mustang. Would assume that they were done for the same reason that Mustangs were done - especially since they were more expensive cars. Think the Talladegas being done goes a long way towards supporting that also since they were painted by the same workers and followed the same process (though the rockers and related panels were held and welded in different jig than the Torino's

[Richard P.]

Completely incorrect. Judges have been instructed many times that they are NOT limited by the judging written rules (read can take off for details not included).

The written rules are there as a description of some of the items to check in that section, major items, items that are often overlooked (rear reminder) or details that are new to the community.

As mentioned before the number of pages limits and keep MCA from including everything that should be looked at and evaluated in any section . We can't put a description for 10% of all the details, like what is pinchweld and any one judging for MCA in a concours class should know what it means - if not that is why we have teams not individuals judging IMHO

Jeff very well stated and this information has been stated many times before on this very forum.