Topic: Red Dyed Hardware

[PerkinsRestoration]

The red finish on seat track hardware and rear axle U Bolt nuts etc. is applied to zinc same as dichromate(Gold), just different color. Green was used on some 71 Control arm nuts etc. Not similar to the red (Dykem type product) used on phoshated hardware. Hard to get platers to do the red and green as Dichromate has become industry preference and is most durable to salt spray according to Mike Wagner At Electroplating. They do Mercury Marine Cad & Zinc.

[Andrew@MagMustangs]

That does explain a lot. I have some of the seat track bolts that are just gold with a very slight reddish tint probably the dye worn off. The dye must have a transparency to the coloring which explains the different coloring on the differently plated parts. You guys are a wealth of knowledge. I love this site!! Andrew

[app01]

May 15, 1970,  Dearborn B2

Earlier on it was mentioned that the strut rod Strut rod OUTER nuts were red,  however, looking at articles and some archives, I have found conflicting information, some showing them natural, others even showing the inside nut red.

Can someone please confirm the finish on these 2 nuts?

Thanks again

[PerkinsRestoration]

 Typical production would be Zinc plate plus red chromate on front nut and zinc phosphate with red (Dykem)on rear nut. 

[app01]

Thanks again.

[Cobrajet428]

I know I'm resurrecting an older thread, but this relates:

Dykem TRANSPARENT Staining Color #81496 has been mentioned here as a good red dye to use. Seems its no longer made. Dykem's website doesn't show it available and the online suppliers showing it do not in fact have it in stock.

I've been able to find Dykem staining color #81491, which is red, but is OPAQUE.

QUESTIONS:

• Has anyone here used this 81491? Does it look OK?
• Has anyone used an alternative they are happy with?

[J_Speegle]

I know I'm resurrecting an older thread, but this relates:

Dykem TRANSPARENT Staining Color #81496 has been mentioned here as a good red dye to use. Seems its no longer made. Dykem's website doesn't show it available and the online suppliers showing it do not in fact have it in stock.

I've been able to find Dykem staining color #81491, which is red, but is OPAQUE.

So it's somewhat a milky clear rather than a just a clear dye? Would be interested in the difference if any from the older stuff. Maybe there is another brand or maker we can find

The bottle I have had for a fairly long time is labeled Transparent - guessing that is where the change is

Don't have the bottle here so cant check the inventory number but apparently its the old stuff.   One of the pet peeves and only thing that seems consistent in the hobby is that once you find something that works  buy a good supply since the next time you go to buy it it will be changed, reformulated or no longer legal in you state or region

[Cobrajet428]

Yeah, more and more nowadays with all the corporate consolidation and globalized sourcing. In some ways we have more options than ever, but others we have less and less.

I'd really hoped that since coloring these safety nuts and bolts is fairly common restoration practice now, that others have found something else that works good. I'd used translucent red paint in the past, but it tends to flake off easily when the hardware is installed, esp. when used on smooth zinc plating. Have also used a red permanent marker, which doesn't flake but doesn't color the zinc well either. Zinc phosphate colors easily, clear zinc or dichromate - not really. Using opaque red dye like the only available Dykem #81491 just seems like it wouldn't look right.

Thought this would be a slam-dunk once I saw your photo of the transparent Dykem #81496.

[TLea]

Just to be clear the red marking wasnt always dye. A general rule is dye on the zinc plated parts and red paint on the phosphate parts

[CharlesTurner]

Dykem dyes can be bought on eBay.

[PerkinsRestoration]

  The color (Red etc.) on Zinc or Cadmium plated parts is Chromate not dye. Dykem's opaque red is very similar to Ford's S100 finish on phosphate items.

[J_Speegle]

  The color (Red etc.) on Zinc or Cadmium plated parts is Chromate not dye. .....

Bob what is the difference between a dye and the chromate  process? When I purchase Dichromate  it sure looks like a dye and appears to be applied in pretty much the same fashion.

Just asking

[PerkinsRestoration]

Jeff,
 Chromates are sealers that when applied to inorganic plating like Zinc together creates a good corrosion resistant finish. Dye like Dykem staining dye are not chromates. Better industrial chromates contain lead and are not for sale without proper EPA etc. certification. The Dykem dye is more identification than protection. S100 finish on Zinc Phosphate is not always red, however the opaque red Dykem  duplicates the factory look in my opinion very well.

[jwc66k]

Dykem's opaque red is very similar to Ford's S100 finish on phosphate items.

To clear up a possible misconception, -S100 is a special finish documented on the drawing for that part. It is not exclusively a red dye as many 64-66 hardware item use -S100 prior to the red being used. All told, there are over 500 hardware items in my 64-73 Mustang hardware data base with -S100 finishes, plus an additional 100 that use -S101, -S102, -S103 and -S104. Without the appropriate drawings, there's no way to tell except from personal experience.
Jim

[J_Speegle]

Jeff,
 Chromates are sealers that when applied to inorganic plating like Zinc together creates a good corrosion resistant finish. Dye like Dykem staining dye are not chromates. Better industrial chromates contain lead and are not for sale without proper EPA etc. certification. The Dykem dye is more identification than protection. S100 finish on Zinc Phosphate is not always red, however the opaque red Dykem  duplicates the factory look in my opinion very well.

Thanks for the simple explanation - can get real technical real quick. Guess the focus for us is getting the right look  when its done



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chromate_and_dichromate

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chromate_conversion_coating




Looks like even the makers of the products sometimes even used the terms interchangeably



http://www.chemical-supermarket.com/Red-Chromate-Dye-p481.html