Topic: Ignition wire routing '65 Dearborn K code

[C5ZZKGT]

-Guys, Please excuse my ignorance but I need to ask what the correct routing of the ignition wires, particularly on the LEFT side of the engine is on my July '65 Dearborn K code?
-Jim Lane explained it to me at Waldorf, and I thought I understood him, but I don't after all-there was something about a couple of the wires being routed out of place intentionally to prevent spark crossover.......anyone got a picture??  Thanks!!

[mgmradio]

Wires should be routed in the clip; 7,5,6,8. 7&8 need to be separated so as not to cause an inductive missfire on #8 when #7 fires.The shop manual shows a  nice drawing of the wire routing.Attached is a picture from my 4500 mile coupe.
  Mike

[Bob Gaines]

Wires should be routed in the clip; 7,5,6,8. 7&8 need to be separated so as not to cause an inductive missfire on #8 when #7 fires.The shop manual shows a  nice drawing of the wire routing.Attached is a picture from my 4500 mile coupe.
  Mike

FYI ,In the real world this induction cross fire issue is not a problem up for street cars or track cars so it is not a necessity to separate the wires however it is definitely the assemblyline way and is necessary for authenticity in show classes. Bob

[mgmradio]

Beg to differ Bob.Ford even issued TSB about the problem every few years. Though rarely a noticeable problem it has destroyed many a #8 piston, especially after electronic ignition was introduced.8o,s and early 90's Crown Victorias were really a problem.
  Mike

[Bob Gaines]

Beg to differ Bob.Ford even issued TSB about the problem every few years. Though rarely a noticeable problem it has destroyed many a #8 piston, especially after electronic ignition was introduced.8o,s and early 90's Crown Victorias were really a problem.
  Mike

Been there done that. I fully expected someone to differ and you are welcome to your opinion. I am not disputing the engineered route or any TSB  . It makes perfect sense to me but just stating a common fact in the real world. A racing environment would be the harshest test for this kind of thing.  Go to a open track event and check how many cars route wires in the specified order . Monterey historic, SAAC open track  etc. I have. I have studied this with my concours judging hat on and asked many racing participants about this and have yet to hear about a problem from ones that run the 7 and 8 parallel. Most think I am crazy after asking . Not to say someone somewhere hasn't had a problem that can be traced to this but from the many dozens or even over a hundred over the years that have said hadn't had any problems in the harsh racing world I have to conclude this is not the issue it is made out to be. I know in years past before my concours studies we never followed the engineered route or even knew about it and never experienced a problem . That included a lot of street racing and drag racing by myself and friends. Just stating what I have found and have experienced. Bob

[buckeyeresto]

The question needs to be answered on that when was the TSB was written and would pre car built cars before the TSB be correct while being shown in the concours class

[CharlesTurner]

Believe the TSB came out in the Summer or Fall of '64.  Jeff might have his handy to check.

[C5ZZKGT]

Wires should be routed in the clip; 7,5,6,8. 7&8 need to be separated so as not to cause an inductive missfire on #8 when #7 fires.The shop manual shows a  nice drawing of the wire routing.Attached is a picture from my 4500 mile coupe.
  Mike

Mike and all, Hey, Thanks for the info and picture! I think I can do this now-pictures always help me! seems so simple now!

[bryancobb]

I fully understand the OP's dilemma.  Based on the date of engine assembly, I suppose, and the date of the TSB, there would be different arrangements.
Add to that fact that the Ford Factory Service Manual shows pictures and diagrams with 2 different arrangements, and the Bob Mannel Book and the
Osborne Manuals/Ford Drawings show differences also.

I would think the only way to have this detail correct is to have vintage pictures of an engine of the same timeframe/foundry/revision level as yours.

Here's my Early 66, Change Level 11, Windsor 289.  Any critique on the wire routing?

[mgmradio]

Bob,
  I am speaking from experience.I've been a Ford mechanic for over 20 years (driveability and electrical), and have diagnosed and fixed cars with drivability concerns caused by this.The usual complaint was/is slight missfire or light trailer hitching on light accel or trying to hold a steady speed climbing a hill (under load). in most cases # 8 spark plug will show signs of being over heated up to and including melted electrod and anode. In extream cases the top of #8 piston will be burnt. I doubt that in a racing environment that the missfire would be felt or the plugs left unchanged long enough to see the problem.
  Attached is a photo copy from the 65 shop manual that shows a photo of the correct routing and in the directions states to rout #7 as shown.
   Mike

[jwc66k]

Different picture in the 66 Shop Manual (sec 9 pg 17) but the same routing.
Jim

[Bob Gaines]

Bob,
  I am speaking from experience.I've been a Ford mechanic for over 20 years (driveability and electrical), and have diagnosed and fixed cars with drivability concerns caused by this.The usual complaint was/is slight missfire or light trailer hitching on light accel or trying to hold a steady speed climbing a hill (under load). in most cases # 8 spark plug will show signs of being over heated up to and including melted electrod and anode. In extream cases the top of #8 piston will be burnt. I doubt that in a racing environment that the missfire would be felt or the plugs left unchanged long enough to see the problem.
  Attached is a photo copy from the 65 shop manual that shows a photo of the correct routing and in the directions states to rout #7 as shown.
   Mike

Mike I am not questioning your experience. I have quite a few years under my belt in this field as well. My point of view is that it isn't as much of a issue out in the real world as 100's of thousands cars that are no doubt driving around with the wiring misrouted  seems to testify to. Just saying you aren't going to shell a engine if you run the wires parallel.That doesn't mean I disavow the Ford procedure. I think the Ford routing makes perfect sense. I wouldn't suggest running Wire #7 and #8 parallel quite the contrary as a am a Concours judge for a number of venues for many years and I always have advocated the routing as specified since I first was made aware of the specified routing more then 30 years ago.  I had been running them the parallel way for at least 10 years before that because it looked neater under the hood. I was just relating my opinion based on my many years of hands on experience as well as observation. I have a right to my opinion and you yours.  Lets leave it at that    . Bob

[Bob Gaines]

I fully understand the OP's dilemma.  Based on the date of engine assembly, I suppose, and the date of the TSB, there would be different arrangements.
Add to that fact that the Ford Factory Service Manual shows pictures and diagrams with 2 different arrangements, and the Bob Mannel Book and the
Osborne Manuals/Ford Drawings show differences also.

I would think the only way to have this detail correct is to have vintage pictures of an engine of the same timeframe/foundry/revision level as yours.

Here's my Early 66, Change Level 11, Windsor 289.  Any critique on the wire routing?

If you look at the distributor cap wires in the picture ,one way you can tell the difference between the Marti repro wires compared to a genuine set is that the genuine set has the differnt angled plug ends at the cap and the Marti repros don't .some are at a 90degree some are at a 45 degree down some can be at a 45 degree up. Bob

[bryancobb]

Bob,  are you saying some original wires come out of the distributor cap and turn LESS than 90 (to point upward) and some turn MORE than 90 (to point downward) but none turn exactly 90?

[mgmradio]

 The easyest way to tell the difference between original and repo wires is that the writing on the wires are different colors on opposite sides of the wire.On unrestored 65 and 66 cars that I have seen with there original wires the only color combination that I have seen is white in one side and red/orange on the other.Replacement wires were made in different combinations. I believe that the color combination indicates the level of RF shielding. Marti wires only come in white and white.
  Mike