Topic: Ball Joint rivet installation

[BHStang]

Does anyone have some pictures on what tooling setup they are using to successfully install the control arm rivets?  I would like to be able to do this myself instead of sending out every set of arms.  The AMK rivets crush fairly easy but keeping them from bending sideways seems to be a real challenge.  Including 1 picture of what I have been using on my press thus far.

 

[Big Al]

Question - do you heat the rivet any before?
Al

[Bob Gaines]

Question - do you heat the rivet any before?
Al

You shouldn't have to.

[BHStang]

They crush easy as its a soft metal.  The problem with heating is you are so close to the rubber dust boot, and cork gasket for that matter that if you got it hot enough to make a difference it would probably become an issue.  Or at least I would think.

[Bob Gaines]

They crush easy as its a soft metal.  The problem with heating is you are so close to the rubber dust boot, and cork gasket for that matter that if you got it hot enough to make a difference it would probably become an issue.  Or at least I would think.

You are correct ,heat will damage the rubber boots. Extreme heat red hot rivets like used to couple steel girders on skyscrapers is not necessary for this situation.   

[Bossbill]

I think you need to build a very sturdy jig that doesn't allow the arms to move while you press in the rivets. Holding these by hand is not going to work.

You should probably make the jig adjustable (bolts) so you can adjust the amount of tilt in both directions (x,y) until you get it just right. You should also capture the top of the arms so NOTHING moves.

[TLea]

Only way to do it properly is to have a high quality press and the jigs and tooling need to be professionally made. I've seen a lot of cut corner set ups and you're just wasting your time. I had my tooling made probably 15 years ago and it cost around 2K then. Probably 200 control arms later its paid off many times.
There also is a learning curve even when you have correct tooling. Good to practice on metal scraps first.

[BHStang]

Who made the tooling and do you have any pictures to share?  I have connections to some professional machine shops just need to work out the design. 

[jwc66k]

Somewhere in the past, I vaguely remember a post about the "press" used to install these rivits. It is not a standard press, it is a stamping press where "tonnage" and "speed" are involved. In other words, you need a VERY special machine shop.
Jim

[TLea]

Honestly, I don?t think the press is anything special other than it needs to be a high-quality where there won?t be a lot of flex and slop involved. My press is a 30 ton and typically the rivets set at about 8 tons.

[ExportMach]

Honestly, I don?t think the press is anything special other than it needs to be a high-quality where there won?t be a lot of flex and slop involved. My press is a 30 ton and typically the rivets set at about 8 tons.

This is the rating I got from the AMK tech rep I spoke with recently.

[dkknab]

Let's say the ball joint is fine but the boot has deteriorated on properly riveted LCAs. Can the boot just be replaced without having to replace the whole ball joint?

[J_Speegle]

Let's say the ball joint is fine but the boot has deteriorated on properly riveted LCAs. Can the boot just be replaced without having to replace the whole ball joint?

Haven't heard of anyone that has been successful at that. Had the same issue in the past where the oil protectant negatively affected the boots so had to them. "Tucking" them didn't work for me

[Bob Gaines]

Let's say the ball joint is fine but the boot has deteriorated on properly riveted LCAs. Can the boot just be replaced without having to replace the whole ball joint?

The lower ball joint rarely wears out .  It is very evident if it is worn out if it is the least bit loose. The lower ball joint is harder to remove and requires extra steps even after the rivets are removed. The upper ball joint is very susceptible to wearing out but it can be rebuilt to factory specs if not otherwise damaged. It comes out when the rivets are removed. You can after cosmetically restoring a lower arm not replace the ball joint and instead replace the boot and boot retainer. Of course that will require new rivets. You can not replace the boot successfully without removing the rivets holding the boot retainer.

[TLea]

This is the rating I got from the AMK tech rep I spoke with recently.

Does AMK even have the correct upper control arm rivets yet? After having them for a long time they had a replacement it was not even close to correct. I ended up having about 1000 made to original specs.