Topic: When was the 65-66 289 Engine Asembly Date Stamped? Discussion

[ChrisV289]

NOTE: These first few threads were separated from another focused on the casting number and date for a 65 289 intake manifold. The separation was done so that we could continue discussing the question of when the "engine assembly date" was stamped in relationship to what parts were attached at the time or in other terms how complete. This is just an exploration and discussion at this time!

So more info might be helpful, such as the assembly date of the engine (pic 1 below). It's on a "tab" on the engine block, the yellow arrow, near the distributor (The red arrow points to the ID number for the HP head.). It's in the format you've called out. If the engine assembly date is before the manifold cast date, then the manifold was cast after the engine was assembled and should not be used. There is also an engine cast date near the starter motor.
Jim

I thought we discussed in another thread that the date stamped near the water pump is the short bloc assembly date and wouldn?t necessarily reflect the full block assembly date? My honey gold has a block casting date of 4H26 with an assembly date a day or two later. The intake has a casting date of 4K19 and the engine tag is also original and has a date of 4K on it. Scheduled build date of the car is October 29, 1964 and sold new on 11/7/64. Latest date I can find is a hood hinge if 10/26. Engine is original as the car was bought in 1992 with only 44k miles.

[J_Speegle]

I thought we discussed in another thread that the date stamped near the water pump is the short bloc assembly date and wouldn?t necessarily reflect the full block assembly date? ...............

That theory/possibility was mentioned before, I believe by me,  but as far as I know it has not been proved.  Still looking and following but haven't collected enough hard data IMO. Work in progress

[Bob Gaines]

I thought we discussed in another thread that the date stamped near the water pump is the short bloc assembly date and wouldn?t necessarily reflect the full block assembly date? My honey gold has a block casting date of 4H26 with an assembly date a day or two later. The intake has a casting date of 4K19 and the engine tag is also original and has a date of 4K on it. Scheduled build date of the car is October 29, 1964 and sold new on 11/7/64. Latest date I can find is a hood hinge if 10/26. Engine is original as the car was bought in 1992 with only 44k miles.

Although the short block assembly date stamped into the block doesn't reflect a exact date for a completed painted and assembled engine I can't think of a better date reference on a part that can be used that would get you closer to the actual completed date.  I would bet that if you took the time between the machining date and the short block assembly date and extrapolated forward the same amount of time you would arrive at a reasonable date that the engine was completed prior to being shipped.

[jwc66k]

I thought we discussed in another thread that the date stamped near the water pump is the short bloc assembly date and wouldn?t necessarily reflect the full block assembly date? .

It's my understanding, and sort of verified in the "Engine Assembly Manuals", that the carburetor, fuel pump, generator/alternator, power steering, air conditioning and smog stuff were added later. Therefore, all those itemS "may" have a later date. The "full block assembly" seems to occur just before the engine was installed.
Jim

[Bob Gaines]

It's my understanding, and sort of verified in the "Engine Assembly Manuals", that the carburetor, fuel pump, generator/alternator, power steering, air conditioning and smog stuff were added later. Therefore, all those itemS "may" have a later date. The "full block assembly" seems to occur just before the engine was installed.
Jim

+1. My engine reference was the engines state in which it was completed so as to be painted and pressure tested before it was shipped to the assemblyine where the finishing items were added.

[J_Speegle]

It's my understanding, and sort of verified in the "Engine Assembly Manuals", that the carburetor, fuel pump, generator/alternator, power steering, air conditioning and smog stuff were added later. Therefore, all those itemS "may" have a later date. The "full block assembly" seems to occur just before the engine was installed.
Jim

But what we're discussing is prior to that and the painting. Those items you mentioned were post paint. The search so far is to see what we can find from good original examples is items not installed at the car plant have casting dates after the date stamped on the block. Items such as heads, exhaust manifolds and intake.

Really need to take some time and look through the engine assembly instructions for the engine plant for the early 289's to see if they have a page with all of the pieces installed at that plant in order.

Again for clarity. This was mentioned before as something I wanted to investigate and see if evidence (more that one or two examples as usual) could support the possibility rather than just trust what we've always believed since we are always discovering new things, data and making contact with more workers - which is more difficult given the years that have past already


The "full block assembly" as you listed didn't all take place just before the engine was installed in the car. We have pictures posted on the site showing that the carburetor  was installed at the engine plant as well as (for manuals) the bellhousing, engine plate, clutch, PCV systems, breather cap, alternator or generator brackets, coil, distributor, spark plugs, spark plug wires  and such as well as the flex plate or flywheel. These last items added after the engine assembly was painted. Sure I missed something other than hardware in that list   

Options/accessories with supporting other items, as well as fuel pumps, don't know why they were left off at the engine plant, were added in a sub assembly area (mezzanine at San Jose) where cars that had their engines and transmissions stamped with the car's VIN was also done.

Might need to separate these last few post to a new thread focusing on when the "engine" assembly date was applied at the engine plant since we are well off the discussion of 65 intake manifolds. 

[jwc66k]

I had to scrape the blue paint off this date code area on the front of the block to better see the code. The bottom line is, if it has blue paint on it, it was put on the engine before it was painted.
Example: A masking cap was put over the water outlet to prevent paint from going in.
Jim

[J_Speegle]

I had to scrape the blue paint off this date code area on the front of the block to better see the code. The bottom line is, if it has blue paint on it, it was put on the engine before it was painted.

Yes that was what I believe we have all come to expect and have witnessed on thousands or tens of thousands of examples, but not really does not address the question of when it was stamped in relationship to all the other parts attached prior to the engine being painted. Just exploring into the possibilities, if the date was stamped before the heads, intake, exhaust manifolds were attached to the short block?  Unfortunately the engine ID tag was stamped with a day of the month or we would want to include that in the mix also on early 289's. 289's for at least now 

Given the delay and the effort to have parts available quickly so that engines could be built to keep up with demand the vast majority of casting dates found on the major parts listed for the top of the engine assembly (not the short block) were available. Just looking for and at those that do not follow that pattern.

[J_Speegle]

Guess since we should be in the data collection part of the research if anyone has what they believe is a fairly compete original 65-66 289 with casting dates they can share I invite them to share them in the thread. For this look into production and since it focuses on the engine plant the cars VIN and scheduled assembly date are not need. Looking for things shown in the template below. If you think some other dates are important feel free to add them. We can discuss those if and when they are added.

Engine block casting date -
Timing cover casting date -
DS cylinder head casting date -
PS cylinder head casting date -
Engine assembly stamp from the DS engine front -
Intake manifold casting date -
DS exhaust manifold casting date -
PS exhaust manifold casting date -
Engine ID tag printing/stampings -

For the heck of it and if you have them - they might come into play since these were on the completed engine when they were shipped to the car assembly plants.
Distributor assembly date -
Carburetor assembly date -


If and or when we expand to later engines we will be likely adding manual bell housings on some engines, valve covers and oil pan.

Really focusing in those assemblies that don't fit the normal pattern if they are out there.

Thanks for looking and sharing if you can.