Topic: Rear-Axle Code for 3.00 Open 8" ?

[RichardM68]

I'm returning my 68 FB to original, as much as possible.  Not quite concourse, but hopefully very close.  My axle, I believe, came off an earlier Mustang.  There's no tag, but visual identification using info from https://maliburacing.com/ford-nine-inch-g-body/ seems to support the argument it's from an earlier Mustang.

My question is, what would have originally been on the axle tag, and axle casting marks, on my car?  My axle code, from the data plate, is "5", an 8" 3.00.  My VIN 8F02J166xxx.  From my research, I believe I need a "WCZ-F".  As far as the "Date built" part of the tag... I have no idea.  My car was built March 11, 1968, but I don't know if axle date codes always matched the rest of the car, etc, etc.

Thanks,

[ruppstang]

I am not 100% sure but think the early mustang rear axels were narrower than the 67-68 ones

[J_Speegle]

I am not 100% sure but think the early mustang rear axels were narrower than the 67-68 ones

+1

[J_Speegle]

My question is, what would have originally been on the axle tag, and axle casting marks, on my car?  My axle code, from the data plate, is "5", an 8" 3.00.  My VIN 8F02J166xxx.  From my research, I believe I need a "WCZ-F".  As far as the "Date built" part of the tag... I have no idea.  My car was built March 11, 1968, but I don't know if axle date codes always matched the rest of the car, etc, etc.

The dates cast into and the tags (dates) that identify them do tern to run in a pattern and is often what is referred to as "matching" the production period of a car.

Guess your looking to order a reproduction and need the information to accomplish this. Don't have as many data points as other years but did find some to base a choice from for your car and production dates.

Below is what yours should look like IMHO. The date (8BA - Year - Month - Week)  could have also been, based on when your car was really completed (March 11th) 8BB - to even 8CA. Plenty of common rearend assemblies completed and installed on cars within a week or two of the cars date given that your car was built at Dearborn

Hope this helps

[RichardM68]

Hi Jeff,

Your comment "...completed and installed on cars within a week or two of the cars date..." is exactly what I was wondering.  It helps me greatly.  Thank you.

I do have a few foilow up questions.

1. What's the difference between "WCZ-F" and "WCZ-F1"?  The only thing I could find online says "only shown when it affects interchange".  That's no help to me.

2. The "931" in your pic is the plant code.  Is that the plant code for Dearborn?

3. The build sheet in your pic made me think of an unrelated question... does anybody have that data for my car?  Marti Auto doesn't.  I would love to return mine to having matching codes.

Actually, I'm not looking for a replacement tag.  I'm looking for a period correct rear axl, or at least a period correct 3rd member (where all the stampings are).  Currently my car has an 8" from a 65 or 66.  This segues nicely into my last question... does anyone know of a salvage yard with a lot of vintage ford rear ends?  :-)

As always, thanks.

-Richard

[J_Speegle]

Hi Jeff,

Your comment "...completed and installed on cars within a week or two of the cars date..." is exactly what I was wondering.  It helps me greatly.  Thank you.

I do have a few follow up questions.

1. What's the difference between "WCZ-F" and "WCZ-F1"?  The only thing I could find online says "only shown when it affects interchange".  That's no help to me.

Don't know. Guess only an engineering from the era would know. Something fairly small was likely changed for some reason. For me the bottom line is that we found the F1 version used and installed on cars like your around the same time. You might find  it is some long forgoted document or book that focuses on the changes they were making at the time but in my experience few of those books remain since the subject is somewhat outside the focus of most restorers 

2. The "931" in your pic is the plant code.  Is that the plant code for Dearborn?

That is a code used at Dearborn to identify that and many more rearends along with this a paper tag, with 931A,  on the end of the axle housing for quick reference. All of the rearends were assembled, for all plants, at the Sterling plant then shipped to the three Mustang plants for installation

3. The build sheet in your pic made me think of an unrelated question... does anybody have that data for my car?  Marti Auto doesn't.  I would love to return mine to having matching codes.

That is odd that Kevin's access to the Ford data base does not show your car. Can't think of anyone that would have matching data for your car. It would be a very long shot that a copy of your cars buildsheet would end up in another car as trash and be found and offered up. Would not hold my breath for that one to happen

[RichardM68]

Excellent.  This is exactly what I needed.  Now starts my long long hunt!

Thanks again,
-Richard

[RichardM68]

Hello.  Reviving this thread. 
So, I purchased an axl tag from Marti Auto.  Since I don't have the original tag, they made their best guess, accurate "within a few days".  The tag shows....

WES-N
3.00        8BD      939

The 3.00 makes sense, as does the 8BD.   The WES-N is a surprise.  When I look up the values, they both appear to have been used in many cars, including Mustangs.  Marti's tag book shows "WCZ-F, F1" were used in "289/302", and "WES-N" was used on "302-4V".  I'm just guessing here but my guess is that WCZ-F, F1 was used on 289's and 2V 302's?  Does that sound correct? 

Also, the new tag shows 939 as the plant code.  I've not been able to find a listing of plant codes.  I thought "931" was Dearborn, and other numbers were other plants.  Does 939 make sense for an 8F02J166xxx car?  Is there a plant code listing anywhere?

Thanks,
-Richard

[J_Speegle]

Hello.  Reviving this thread. 
So, I purchased an axl tag from Marti Auto.  Since I don't have the original tag, they made their best guess, accurate "within a few days".  The tag shows....

WES-N
3.00        8BD      939

The 3.00 makes sense, as does the 8BD.   The WES-N is a surprise.  When I look up the values, they both appear to have been used in many cars, including Mustangs.  Marti's tag book shows "WCZ-F, F1" were used in "289/302", and "WES-N" was used on "302-4V".  I'm just guessing here but my guess is that WCZ-F, F1 was used on 289's and 2V 302's?  Does that sound correct? 

Without know more about how your car was ordered and built can't really comment on that code. For example is your car a GT on non GT (8" or 9" rearend)  Makes a difference so we could start there

Also, the new tag shows 939 as the plant code.  I've not been able to find a listing of plant codes.  I thought "931" was Dearborn, and other numbers were other plants.  Does 939 make sense for an 8F02J166xxx car?  Is there a plant code listing anywhere?

I guess Kevin found that the term for that set of numbers is "Plant code" though for me it really does not describe the code. Its an identifying quick code that as shown above in another example can be used to identify the third member and the one listed on the buildsheet.

Believe the code was in house code at the Sterling Plant that was likely used at all three plants not specific to one car plant

[RichardM68]

Just for clarity, Kevin didn't use the term "plant code".  When I looked up how to decode the tag, the various websites refer to it as "plant code".

So, how would someone trying to figure out the plant-code make an educated guess?

What if I had an unrestored J code Mustang, from Dearborn, say 10 VIN's from mine and completed on the same day.  Would it be reasonable to say that those two rear ends came from the same plant?  I'm assuming these types of parts arrived in bulk from different plants and were used FIFO.  If so, that makes an argument that a car close in VIN would very likely share the same code.  I use terms like "very likely" because I'm aware, for example, that if the car in front of mine got the last 931, i might end up with the first 939. 

Thanks,
-Richard

[rhjanes]

Hi Richard,
Jeff, or others, please correct me if I'm wrong.

Richard you are referring to the "Axle Code" and you seem to be saying that is a Plant code for Dearborn.   I don't think that is correct.   Dearborn, as many other manufacturing plants, were and still produce several similar product lines.   Today the Kansas City Ford truck plant produces the F-150 truck and also the Transit van.   The truck plants in Kentucky and Ohio produce F250, F350, F450, F550.....  Dearborn in the 1960's was producing Cougars along with Mustangs.   The cars would have different axle assemblies installed based on a number of factors, including V8 versus 6 cylinder, engine displacement, car built for highway use versus a hot rod.  2:79 gears, 3:00 gears, Lockers, 3:91 gears.   All being installed as assemblies on a moving assembly line.  Each of those axle assembles was assigned a unique code, such as that 931.   The assembly line worker installing axles simply looked at the Build Sheet, saw "931" and took his hoist over to the bin loaded with 931 axles and grabbed one to install.   The next car had some other code, so he installed that coded axle assembly.   The axle assembly was produced from the axle plant with the metal tag attached with the information on it.  Those were meant to be mostly permanently attached.  The assembly also had a paper tag wrapped around the axle with the "931" in big letters. (maybe the man on axles on third shift has 20/50 corrected vision....he needs to see that big paper number or he's installing the incorrect axle assembly).  Those paper tags vanished as the vehicle was used in snow, rain, mud.  Maybe some paper tags were torn off or smudged during shipment to the assembly plant.  But the metal tag would hopefully remain to allow a mechanic to quickly see what was supposed to be inside that axle.  He could order parts before he even took the assembly apart.

The sub assembly plants, such as for axle assemblies, were also producing multiples of different assemblies.  They would have a code for the plant and every axle assembly they produced would have that plant code.  But they were perhaps producing 50 different axle assemblies for the Ford passenger car lines (Comets, Mustangs, Galaxies, station wagons) so that 931 axle assembly code was just one of many.  That code, perhaps, would only be installed on Cougars and Mustangs. 

Marti probably had to correlate what was known about your car based on the VIN.  Perhaps they narrowed down the dates and which of a few different axle assemblies were possible based on the information they had. 

Your other sources saying 931 equaled "plant code", probably just needed to make a common term that perhaps they use for everything.  Chevy, Dodge, Pontiac, Yugo....

I hope I'm sort of correct in this and welcome other comments.
R

[jwc66k]

If I may direct you to using this Forum's library. You will find a topic "ConcoursMustang.com Official 68 Mustang Article List" which has a link to "Ford Car Parts" (aka MPC), 1975 edition,. It lists all the axle codes (5 1/2 pages of them) for 1965 thru 1973.
Jim

[J_Speegle]

Just for clarity, Kevin didn't use the term "plant code".  When I looked up how to decode the tag, the various websites refer to it as "plant code".

Thanks for clearing that up and at this point I thing we have a couple of matching explanations as to what the code was used for and how it was indicated

So, how would someone trying to figure out the plant-code make an educated guess?

Well pretty easy for that one. We determine which rearend your car came with - We have 3.00 open I believe but you have not mentioned if its a 8 or 9 inch (GT or nonGT). From there we find another car with the same rearend (buildsheet or untouched tag and rearend. That would lead us to a fairly safe IMO conclusion

What if I had an unrestored J code Mustang, from Dearborn, say 10 VIN's from mine and completed on the same day.  Would it be reasonable to say that those two rear ends came from the same plant?

Yes they both would have come from the Sterling Plant like all IMO the other ones being installed in Mustangs and (at San Jose or Dearborn) Cougars

I'm assuming these types of parts arrived in bulk from different plants and were used FIFO.

There is no indication that I know of and from interviews the plants did not always use the oldest stock they had on hand. Different plants had different amounts of storage space available and the type of parts were handled differently from one another at times.

  If so, that makes an argument that a car close in VIN would very likely share the same code.  I use terms like "very likely" because I'm aware, for example, that if the car in front of mine got the last 931, i might end up with the first 939. 

That is why we like to look for examples built before and after so that hopefully the "book ends" match and there is not a conflict suggested. If there is then we hope and try to find examples as close as possible to the target date and car. In many cases, unless there is out side forces that compel a change (Federal law for example) change over periods can be  over a number of days or longer. Just depends on the part and the situation

[RichardM68]

Hi Richard,
Jeff, or others, please correct me if I'm wrong.

Richard you are referring to the "Axle Code" and you seem to be saying that is a Plant code for Dearborn.   I don't think that is correct.   Dearborn, as many other manufacturing plants, were and still produce several similar product lines.   Today the Kansas City Ford truck plant produces the F-150 truck and also the Transit van.   The truck plants in Kentucky and Ohio produce F250, F350, F450, F550.....  Dearborn in the 1960's was producing Cougars along with Mustangs.   The cars would have different axle assemblies installed based on a number of factors, including V8 versus 6 cylinder, engine displacement, car built for highway use versus a hot rod.  2:79 gears, 3:00 gears, Lockers, 3:91 gears.   All being installed as assemblies on a moving assembly line.  Each of those axle assembles was assigned a unique code, such as that 931.   The assembly line worker installing axles simply looked at the Build Sheet, saw "931" and took his hoist over to the bin loaded with 931 axles and grabbed one to install.   The next car had some other code, so he installed that coded axle assembly.   The axle assembly was produced from the axle plant with the metal tag attached with the information on it.  Those were meant to be mostly permanently attached.  The assembly also had a paper tag wrapped around the axle with the "931" in big letters. (maybe the man on axles on third shift has 20/50 corrected vision....he needs to see that big paper number or he's installing the incorrect axle assembly).  Those paper tags vanished as the vehicle was used in snow, rain, mud.  Maybe some paper tags were torn off or smudged during shipment to the assembly plant.  But the metal tag would hopefully remain to allow a mechanic to quickly see what was supposed to be inside that axle.  He could order parts before he even took the assembly apart.

The sub assembly plants, such as for axle assemblies, were also producing multiples of different assemblies.  They would have a code for the plant and every axle assembly they produced would have that plant code.  But they were perhaps producing 50 different axle assemblies for the Ford passenger car lines (Comets, Mustangs, Galaxies, station wagons) so that 931 axle assembly code was just one of many.  That code, perhaps, would only be installed on Cougars and Mustangs. 

Marti probably had to correlate what was known about your car based on the VIN.  Perhaps they narrowed down the dates and which of a few different axle assemblies were possible based on the information they had. 

Your other sources saying 931 equaled "plant code", probably just needed to make a common term that perhaps they use for everything.  Chevy, Dodge, Pontiac, Yugo....

I hope I'm sort of correct in this and welcome other comments.
R

If I understand you correctly, 931 for example, denotes features of the rear-axl, but not the plant where it was manufactured.  That gives me 2 more questions.  1) how do I decode those three digits?  and 2) where is the plant identified, if at all, on the rear-axl?

Thanks,
-Richard

[RichardM68]

Thanks for clearing that up and at this point I thing we have a couple of matching explanations as to what the code was used for and how it was indicated


Well pretty easy for that one. We determine which rearend your car came with - We have 3.00 open I believe but you have not mentioned if its a 8 or 9 inch (GT or nonGT). From there we find another car with the same rearend (buildsheet or untouched tag and rearend. That would lead us to a fairly safe IMO conclusion



Yes they both would have come from the Sterling Plant like all IMO the other ones being installed in Mustangs and (at San Jose or Dearborn) Cougars


There is no indication that I know of and from interviews the plants did not always use the oldest stock they had on hand. Different plants had different amounts of storage space available and the type of parts were handled differently from one another at times.


That is why we like to look for examples built before and after so that hopefully the "book ends" match and there is not a conflict suggested. If there is then we hope and try to find examples as close as possible to the target date and car. In many cases, unless there is out side forces that compel a change (Federal law for example) change over periods can be  over a number of days or longer. Just depends on the part and the situation

Hi Jeff.  Thanks for the answers.  That clears up several questions I had.  My car is a non-GT. 

-Richard