Topic: Steering Box

[65IVYGT]

My 65 GT (SJ) has factory power steering...which might invite a HCC-AW steering box. I have a HCC-AX steering box, which I believe came with the Special Handling / GT package.

My question is: was it more common for the factory to install a HCC-AX box in a GT even if it had factory power steering?

Thx...

[jwc66k]

My 65 GT (SJ) has factory power steering...

As a point of curiosity, how do you know you have factory power steering?
Jim

[J_Speegle]

My 65 GT (SJ) has factory power steering...which might invite a HCC-AW steering box. I have a HCC-AX steering box, which I believe came with the Special Handling / GT package.

Basic first steps. What is the date code on the tag? Guess its bolted in the car so you cant look at the casting date on the main body 

My question is: was it more common for the factory to install a HCC-AX box in a GT even if it had factory power steering?

Don't recall that being the practice but will look through what I've got available

[jwc66k]

My 65 GT (SJ) has factory power steering...

As a point of curiosity, how do you know you have factory power steering?

To further clarify my question, my 1965 San Jose (May 11) GT Fastback has power steering, but it is not listed on the window sticker. Ford offered power steering add on kits for most (if not all) their models in that time period (for 65 Mustangs - C5ZZ-3A634-D, linkage kit; C5ZZ-3A635-F or K, pump kit), and a GT without P/S has the same ratio steering box as the P/S box, so it was an "easy" upgrade.
Jim

[65IVYGT]

Jeff, date code is 5E13C (4 days before scheduled build date) and yes, it is installed so I can't see the casting number, unfortunately. I guess I assumed it was factory installed...and if I've learned anything, I should never assume. Thx.

[rocket289k]

My 65 GT (Metuchen build) was bucked on July 21st.  Different plant than your car, but in this case it shouldn't matter.  My GT is a power steering car and has the HCC-AW tag on the steering box.  The date on my steering box tag is 5G13B (8 days prior to the car assembly beginning). 

I've always understood the HCC-AX box to denote a manual steering car with the special handling package and / or GT package and the HCC-AW box to denote a power steering car (with or without the with the special handling package and / or GT package).  There is no special GT steering box for a power steering equipped car. They simply received the same identical quick ratio box as all other power steering cars.

Functionally speaking, an AX and AW steering box both possess the same quicker 16:1 ratio vs. the 19:1 ratio on a regular manual steering box.  The difference between the AW and AX steering box was in the preload specs.  The torque required to turn the shaft is higher on the manual steering box (AX) as the physical forces on the manual box would be higher than on the power steering box (which is assisted by the hydraulic ram).

From the Shop Manual

HCC-AT Manual, 19:1, 4 5/8 Steering wheel turns, 4-5 in-lbs worm bearing preload, 9-10 in-lbs total preload

HCC-AX Special Manual, 16:1 3 3/4 Steering wheel turns, 4-5 in-lbs worm bearing preload, 9-10 in-lbs total preload (Special Handling and / or GT Package)

HCC-AW Power, 16:1, 3 3/4 Steering wheel turns, 3-4 in-lbs worm bearing preload, 8-9 in-lbs total preload (with or without the Special Handling and / or GT Package

PS - For what it's worth, I've personally never seen a factory GT with power steering that hasn't had a HCC-AW steering box installed. 

Regards,

Ron

[Richdowl]

My Metuchen built 1966 GT Coupe was built on August 26th, 2nd day of the 1966 model year. I have an HCC AT steering box with a build date of August 11, 1965 and its original. I've been told that not every manual steering factory GTs had the HCC AX steering box and then there are the occasional mistakes made at the factory. Every other GT requirements have been verified as factory including the Buck Tag.

[J_Speegle]

My Metuchen built 1966 GT Coupe was built on August 26th, 2nd day of the 1966 model year. I have an HCC AT steering box with a build date of August 11, 1965 and its original. I've been told that not every manual steering factory GTs had the HCC AX steering box and then there are the occasional mistakes made at the factory. Every other GT requirements have been verified as factory including the Buck Tag.

First that's for sharing. Of course there were mistakes made here and there at times but in general workers and those supporting them were paid to get the right part on the right car. The wrong part on any car does not make it correct or right for the car and application while guidance (when a part has been replaced or is missing) should IMHO reflect what Ford intended every car to have.

Mistake cars can be a battle and create some difficult choices. Each owner or builder has to make what many might be difficult to make, choices.  If you choose to restore as actually built then, document and document more before hand then be prepared for those questions and in some cases disbelief.

BTW guessing your car has a door/warranty tag date showing a scheduled (or guessed) date of Aug 26th. Possibly not when it was really built    

[jwc66k]

My Metuchen built 1966 GT Coupe was built on August 26th, 2nd day of the 1966 model year. I have an HCC AT steering box with a build date of August 11, 1965 and its original. I've been told that not every manual steering factory GTs had the HCC AX steering box and then there are the occasional mistakes made at the factory. Every other GT requirements have been verified as factory including the Buck Tag.

You might consider verifying the steering box ratio. To do this, jack up the front end and put the car on jack stands. Then get in the car. Turn the steering wheel all the way to either the right of left. Determine the position of the steering wheel by using one of the arms to do that - remember which arm and the direction it's pointing. Then turn the steering wheel in the other direction and count the number of times that arm passes its original starting point direction and how far it went in not a full revolution past that point, a fraction of a full turn. Repeat this going back the other way. And repeat the entire cycle a couple of times. I've done this a couple of times to check a P/S box but unfortunately can't remember the numbers.
Jim

[krelboyne]

It has been my understanding that the steering boxes were an assembly, which included the Pitman arm.
The tag codes identified a combination of ratio and manual or power assist, sector shaft size (1967), etc.

[jwc66k]

It has been my understanding that the steering boxes were an assembly, which included the Pitman arm.
The tag codes identified a combination of ratio and manual or power assist, sector shaft size (1967), etc.

The "1964-65 Mustang Chassis Assembly Manual" (AM0005) pgs 40-44, show the arm and box are assembled on the car, not pre-assembled.
The replacement arm for a standard Mustang V8 is the same for non-power steering and power steering equipped car. I6 Mustangs use a different arm for P/S and non-P/S. Shelby uses a special Shelby arm.
The difference between a 65-66 V8 GT steering box and all 65-66 V8 Mustangs with power steering is the "pre-load" (read the service manual for specifics) even though they have the same steering ratio.
Jim

[Richdowl]

Jeff,
Thanks for the response. You are correct the door warrenty tag has a build date of 26H or August 26th and the Buck Tag build date is H30 or August 30th. The last 6 digits of the VIN is 101612 the 1612 vehicle assembeled for the 66 model year at Metuchen so I tend to beileve the Buck Tag date given the 1st day of 66 production at Metuchen was August 24th or 25th.
Rich

[jwc66k]

The last 6 digits of the VIN is 101612 the 1612 vehicle assembeled for the 66 model year at Metuchen so I tend to beileve the Buck Tag date given the 1st day of 66 production at Metuchen was August 24th or 25th.

Per the "Mustang Production Guide, Vol 1" pg39, the first day of Mustang production at Metuchen was the August 25th, 1965, a Wednesday. 

I've always understood the HCC-AX box to denote a manual steering car with the special handling package and / or GT package and the HCC-AW box to denote a power steering car (with or without the with the special handling package and / or GT package).  There is no special GT steering box for a power steering equipped car. They simply received the same identical quick ratio box as all other power steering cars.
Functionally speaking, an AX and AW steering box both possess the same quicker 16:1 ratio vs. the 19:1 ratio on a regular manual steering box.  The difference between the AW and AX steering box was in the preload specs.  The torque required to turn the shaft is higher on the manual steering box (AX) as the physical forces on the manual box would be higher than on the power steering box (which is assisted by the hydraulic ram).
From the Shop Manual
HCC-AT Manual, 19:1, 4 5/8 Steering wheel turns, 4-5 in-lbs worm bearing preload, 9-10 in-lbs total preload
HCC-AX Special Manual, 16:1 3 3/4 Steering wheel turns, 4-5 in-lbs worm bearing preload, 9-10 in-lbs total preload (Special Handling and / or GT Package)
HCC-AW Power, 16:1, 3 3/4 Steering wheel turns, 3-4 in-lbs worm bearing preload, 8-9 in-lbs total preload (with or without the Special Handling and / or GT Package
PS - For what it's worth, I've personally never seen a factory GT with power steering that hasn't had a HCC-AW steering box installed. 

I knew the info was somewhere.
Jim