Topic: Canadian Engine Differences Discussion

[Coralsnake]

NOTE: This discussion was separated from another specifically about a particular car and engine type. It was separated so more focus could be given to the general subject

Starter thread http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?topic=22645.new;topicseen

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Can we explore the differences of a car sent to Canada some more? Im wondering if there is any build sheet evidence of different engines being used for Canadian builds?

That does not seem to be the case when it comes to other engine displacements, but I could be wrong.

[J_Speegle]

Can we explore the differences of a car sent to Canada some more? Im wondering if there is any build sheet evidence of different engines being used for Canadian builds?

That does not seem to be the case when it comes to other engine displacements, but I could be wrong.

To expand (we'll do it here as see if we need to split off) wouldn't the engine code on the buildsheet be a different one that a 50 state code?  Has anyone seen a engine coding list with a non-emission, Canadian or similar notation?

I'll have to find some time to go back through what I have. I invite others to do the same. See a new thread a'coming    Which is good - discussion should equal sharing and learning

[krelboyne]

Can we explore the differences of a car sent to Canada some more? Im wondering if there is any build sheet evidence of different engines being used for Canadian builds?

That does not seem to be the case when it comes to other engine displacements, but I could be wrong.

I think that you are correct. Royce can chime in, but I believe that the W code 427-4V, and R code 428CJ for 1968 all had complete Thermactor smog systems for export?

S codes for 1968 in Canada often times have the 'Emissions Delete' on the Marti, and have open emissions with 1967 air cleaners. Was it the whole year, select cars?

Not positive on the C and J code cars, do not think that they had IMCO in 1968 for Canada DSO cars. Think open emissions and 1967 air cleaners?

No idea on 6 shooters, but we are getting off topic.

[J_Speegle]

As you can see I separated the subject

Going through my buildsheet copies I offer the following. Will add more to this post as I find more. Will include an update date at the bottom to indicate updates

NOTE: Not certain if Shelby's should be included. Just don't know if they were affected or different based on Canadian delivery/ordering codes but don't think buildsheets are going to show that anyway

8T01C1009xx
- Automatic
- Ordered out of DSO B1
- Projected build date of 23 or 25H
- Engine code of CN236J - on other C code auto (Decemeber 67 cars) I show K266J

Stop me if this is too far off subject but since I'm in the "stack"
8T03C1502xx
- 3 Speed
- Ordered out of DSO 95 (Export car sent to somewhere)
- Projected build date of 13A
- Engine code of 231J (other manual trans for the 50 states are coded K231J)

Have another from 8?02S1150xx but the edge is cropped and half the engine code is missing

[RoyceP]

We have some good examples of both the 428CJ and 427-4V in Canada.

The Canadian sold 427-4V GT-E Cougars had the full Thermactor system and were identical in every way to USA bound cars.

The Canadian sold 428CJ was different. Canadian bound cars had no Thermactor system installed. Instead they had plugs in the cylinder head holes. All the examples that I am aware of were equipped with automatic transmission and built in Dearborn. Tom Cherry has a 1966 - 72 Canadian MPC that confirms this but I have not heard from him in years.

I think that you are correct. Royce can chime in, but I believe that the W code 427-4V, and R code 428CJ for 1968 all had complete Thermactor smog systems for export?

S codes for 1968 in Canada often times have the 'Emissions Delete' on the Marti, and have open emissions with 1967 air cleaners. Was it the whole year, select cars?

Not positive on the C and J code cars, do not think that they had IMCO in 1968 for Canada DSO cars. Think open emissions and 1967 air cleaners?

No idea on 6 shooters, but we are getting off topic.

[Coralsnake]

The Canadian sold 428CJ was different. Canadian bound cars had no Thermactor system installed. Instead they had plugs in the cylinder head holes. All the examples that I am aware of were equipped with automatic transmission and built in Dearborn. Tom Cherry has a 1966 - 72 Canadian MPC that confirms this but I have not heard from him in years.

Thanks, I have heard this, but have not seen the documentation. In the case of 1968 Shelbys, I am convinced this was not the case.

[krelboyne]

Thanks, I have heard this, but have not seen the documentation. In the case of 1968 Shelbys, I am convinced this was not the case.

For both the GT-500 and the GT500KR?

[Coralsnake]

That would be my contention all big block Shelbys were built with smog, to the same standard, then sold.

I am interested in learning about the Mustangs.

[Bob Gaines]

That would be my contention all big block Shelbys were built with smog, to the same standard, then sold.

I am interested in learning about the Mustangs.

+1. Have not seen any reasonable evidence to the contrary.

[Coralsnake]

Let me provide some support for my statement. I have approximately 200 build sheets from 1968 Shelbys. The engine ID codes are the same regardless of shipping destinations.

Cobra Jets are 407j or 408j / auto/ 4spd

GT500s are  405 jo5 or 405 jo4 /auto /4spd

[J_Speegle]

Just to be inclusive and cover the bases

GT350 w/Auto 284J01
GT350 4 Spd   283J01

Agree it appears to changes, dependent on ordering district, for the Shelby's in 68

[Coralsnake]

Being specialized does have its drawbacks sometimes

[FoxChassis]

As you all can tell, some of the engine tag numbers posted above have more characters than others.  It appears that the second and or first character(s) in some of the tag numbers has/have been omitted.

I believe the first character, if present, is the 'calibration' code.  It should be different for 49-state, 50-state, California, Canada, export, etc.  Perhaps a 'standard' (50-state?) calibration has no calibration code at the beginning of the engine tag number but a 'special' calibration does have a code? For example, K231A versus CK231A.

I believe the second character, if present, indicates a combination of ancillaries/accessories, i.e. Thermactor air pump or not, A/C compressor or not, power steering pump or not, etc.  For example K231A versus 231A.

The three numbers and the succeeding letter should always be present.  I believe the numbers represent the engine displacement & carburetor and the succeeding letter represents the calibration & revision level.

[RoyceP]

How many of those build sheets are from Shelbys that were built for Canada DSO's?

Let me provide some support for my statement. I have approximately 200 build sheets from 1968 Shelbys. The engine ID codes are the same regardless of shipping destinations.

Cobra Jets are 407j or 408j / auto/ 4spd

GT500s are  405 jo5 or 405 jo4 /auto /4spd

[RoyceP]

I see this mistake often when someone refers to "49 state" applications. This is not true because in 1968 Arizona had the same restrictions as California. So if you must refer to a number of states in 1968 the correct number is 48.

Jeff I respectfully submit that this discussion will quickly go off the rails into misleading territory if too many model years / engine sizes are discussed at once.

As you all can tell, some of the engine tag numbers posted above have more characters than others.  It appears that the second and or first character(s) in some of the tag numbers has/have been omitted.

I believe the first character, if present, is the 'calibration' code.  It should be different for 49-state, 50-state, California, Canada, export, etc.  Perhaps a 'standard' (50-state?) calibration has no calibration code at the beginning of the engine tag number but a 'special' calibration does have a code? For example, CK231A versus K231A.

I believe the second character, if present, indicates a combination of ancillaries/accessories, i.e. Thermactor air pump or not, A/C compressor or not, power steering pump or not, etc.  For example K231A versus 231A.

The three numbers and the succeeding letter should always be present.  I believe the numbers represent the engine displacement & carburetor and the succeeding letter represents the calibration & revision level.