Topic: Trunk Painting Sequence

[Bossbill]

Never mind that I've said numerous times I was going to paint the trunk "this weekend" more than a few times. I finally have the weather, the help, the paint, the catalyst and the roller platform for the underfloor paint (while I'm there).

I thought I had the painting sequence down but the hinge paint sequence was still confusing. Then I actually looked at my laptop background of a bunch of 67 Mustangs in the Shelby lot waiting to be converted. It's shown here.


In that pic there are a number of cars without the rear plastic cover. And then I noticed that all of the uncovered cars had full paint coverage on the part of the hinge that contacts the trunk lid. (Shelbys were painted at the SJ plant without a trunk lid or any rear end caps)

Looking at one of the unrestored Shelbys here:
http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?topic=13542.0

I was always wondering why the underside of the hinge had little paint in Shelbys


I also wondered how the particular shadows got there in this picture:


It's been assumed that Shelbys were painted with the hinges up, just like Mustangs.
What I surmise from these pictures is:
* There is full paint coverage on the top of the hinges
* There is almost no coverage on the underside of the hinge
* If the hinge was up there would be paint on the red oxide portion at label A
* If the hinge was down it would account for the lack of paint at label B
* If the hinge was down it would account for the lack of paint at label C
* If the hinges were sprung and up the lack of a decklid forces the passenger hinge into contact with the trunk lip, leaving a telltale lack of paint 

I surmise from the paint details that Shelbys were painted with the trunk hinges down, not up. Only down accounts for all of these details.

[Bob Gaines]

Never mind that I've said numerous times I was going to paint the trunk "this weekend" more than a few times. I finally have the weather, the help, the paint, the catalyst and the roller platform for the underfloor paint (while I'm there).

I thought I had the painting sequence down but the hinge paint sequence was still confusing. Then I actually looked at my laptop background of a bunch of 67 Mustangs in the Shelby lot waiting to be converted. It's shown here.


In that pic there are a number of cars without the rear plastic cover. And then I noticed that all of the uncovered cars had full paint coverage on the part of the hinge that contacts the trunk lid. (Shelbys were painted at the SJ plant without a trunk lid or any rear end caps)

Looking at one of the unrestored Shelbys here:
http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?topic=13542.0

I was always wondering why the underside of the hinge had little paint in Shelbys


I also wondered how the particular shadows got there in this picture:


It's been assumed that Shelbys were painted with the hinges up, just like Mustangs.
What I surmise from these pictures is:
* There is full paint coverage on the top of the hinges
* There is almost no coverage on the underside of the hinge
* If the hinge was up there would be paint on the red oxide portion at label A
* If the hinge was down it would account for the lack of paint at label B
* If the hinge was down it would account for the lack of paint at label C
* If the hinges were sprung and up the lack of a decklid forces the passenger hinge into contact with the trunk lip, leaving a telltale lack of paint 

I surmise from the paint details that Shelbys were painted with the trunk hinges down, not up. Only down accounts for all of these details.

Good catch. I agree with you.

[J_Speegle]

I surmise from the paint details that Shelbys were painted with the trunk hinges down, not up. Only down accounts for all of these details.

Don't believe I agree fully. Some may have been but IMHO the statement is to broad when you look at one example and try and apply it to all 67 Shelbys.

How were the spring and retaining donut painted so well if painted down?  And how was each hinge held downward since the spring was installed?

With those question we may be focusing on one example where they may have painted it down or partially retracted but believe we need to look at others to get a better look at production practices

It is interesting that during the period of when the storage area picture was taken the hinges appear to be retracted on those cars. Wonder how they were held down with the trunk spring in place


Will collect up other examples and lets see where it takes us

[J_Speegle]

As a follow up I found a fair number of pictures to offer but have to format and figure out how best to present the findings. Either by car or by area. Like DS trunk hinge at trunk lid, DS hinge at body....

Lots of variations though a few sub patterns that appear to relate to where and how the painter was standing which may look affect the pattern and not suggest if the hinges were fully extended or not.

Just reporting back since it took an hour and half just to go through the pictures 

[Bob Gaines]

The lot pictures show that the hinges had to be held down in some fashion or another down given the plastic covering the trunk area of Shelby units for shipment. They may have taken the spring bar loose at the fashioner and allowed the bar to rest in the trunk however that would most likely had been after painting given the paint angles covered.

[J_Speegle]

The lot pictures show that the hinges had to be held down in some fashion or another down given the plastic covering the trunk area of Shelby units for shipment. They may have taken the spring bar loose at the fashioner and allowed the bar to rest in the trunk however that would most likely had been after painting given the paint angles covered.

Agreed they are in the down position allowing for the sealing of the trunk, in transit. Looking at the Goodyear picture its hard to see colored cars but the lighter and white cars the details stand out and it appears that the trunk spring is fully in place IMHO but hinges are still retracted.  If they had disengaged the spring on one side (the drivers side) this would have meant the extra rubber donut would be removed and we would find scratches in the paint on that end of the spring from removal and re-installation.  It would also mean that the donut would have had to be transported with the car since, located and reinstalled also.

Two areas of the one Good year picture enlarged below showing full view of a blue and white example. To me both appear to have the spring fully engaged though both hinges are in the down position. Dows not appear that the far passenger end of the spring is disengaged and that would show up in original examples with marks from removing and re-installation of the end clip and what ever damage would happen to the paint on both.


Will look to see if we can find, on those cars where the outer end of the hinges are fully painted, provides a clue maybe scratches or marks from being "tied down"

Considered all fo this a few times just never took the time to go through the process and discuss the possibilities.  Guess the time is now

[Bob Gaines]

That is a lot of spring tension to contend with if connected.

[Bossbill]

Remember when I said I'd paint this weekend?
I just got tossed a house project that involves digging a 5'x5'x5' foot deep egress window for the basement. I have a tractor, but this is in a tough place. The concrete saw guy has an opening...now!

On the torsion spring, this thing is wound tight. I built a tool to wind it up so it would go into the hole. The only way it stays put is with the one way clip installed. And once it is installed I think it rests against the trunk gutter lip. Leaving a paint shadow.

If it was painted up and then put back down, whoever put it down would have to have a one way clip remover and torsion tool in hand. I've tried it with my hand and it's not easy. One slip and it would take out a bunch of hand.

My torsion rod had a lot of paint on it everywhere. Is it possible it was dipped or painted separately?

Just trying to figure this out.
Thanks for your thoughts and help!

PS -- I just took half a dozen pics of how the torsion rod sits in the various configurations.
I'll post in a few minutes after I download them.

[Bossbill]

Here are some pics of the hinges and torsion rods in various configurations.


With the torsion rod attached and with no decklid in place the driver's side hinge is up against the trunk gutter. This would leave a shadow behind the hinge. This isn't an issue with a trunk attached as the trunk aligns the driver side hinge even with the passenger side. The passenger side hinge has a stop, but the driver side does not.
The Tootsie Roll is usually installed but I removed it for picture clarity.


This is the passenger side hinge with the stop. The stop is the small bar to which the torsion bar is attached. If you have good hinges the torsion bar will stay in place.


If you try to move either hinge it will pop out and damage the flat area between the gutter and the window.


After you remove the torsion bar from the stop it will rest like this.


If you pull the torsion rod out of the driver's side and simply flip the rod 180* it rests like this.
This may be the Shelby lot configuration. It may also be how the trunk was originally painted.


Regardless, the Tootsie Roll does hold the torsion bar in place during transport even without it being engaged on the passenger side. It just sits there!
I did note that if the Tootsie Roll is new and compliant it is very easy to remove and replace.

[J_Speegle]

Yes things can get in the way of other plans

If it was painted up and then put back down, whoever put it down would have to have a one way clip remover and torsion tool in hand. I've tried it with my hand and it's not easy. One slip and it would take out a bunch of hand.

This would also mean that the clip and the end of the rod's paint should show the movement and in turn damage but we;ve not found that on original cars

My torsion rod had a lot of paint on it everywhere. Is it possible it was dipped or painted separately?

No it was painted on the car since the Tootsie Roll was painted on the end of the spring and left a shadow - only black under the roll when removed.

Just trying to figure this out.
Thanks for your thoughts and help!

Yes it is a puzzle at this point. Also need to look through my Ford pictures. Recall a fixture installed on one car (non Mustang I believe) that held the trunk lid in place - part open - part closed during the painting of that type of car.

PS -- I just took half a dozen pics of how the torsion rod sits in the various configurations.
I'll post in a few minutes after I download them.

Yes thanks. Good to have an owner and car at the right stage to try some things out.

Challenge I have (will get to the picture posting also) is that we have a fair number of hinges with the ends with a nice heavy coat on the bottom surfaces also as if they were in the full upright position and often one painted nicely and the other not painted at the end which to me indicates not a difference in position but the painters choice to not paint the end or ends on some cars and fully painting others.  Similar situation as we see on 69-70 Shelby trunk hinges where the ends and one, two or no bolt heads (bolt installed) received paint as covered in another thread I believe.

What is different in this case (not sure if we have pictures of the rear of the 69-70 during shipment) is the later pictures with the hinges retracted.  We must remember that this is likely two different unassociated stages of the cars life though related to the same parts

Good discussion

[J_Speegle]

Looking at the pile of examples I have to share I first considered putting them up by the area of the trunk hinge so they could be compared side by side but then realized that if I did that then we would not see the possible cause and affect each individual car had from the spray pattern the painter used on that particular car. So to not loose that comparison, where available here are some pictures by car.

Will offer some observations from my view when I get them all posted and we can discuss further

Will post cars with more helpful pictures to those with only one or two

67 #80x

Arm appears to have full but somewhat lighter paint on bottom side




Arm appears to have full but slightly heavier paint coat on passenger side. No shadow visible in picture on lower hinge or body hinge bracket



Decent paint coat (little light inside arm up towards the top) on hinge and no shadows




"Back" outer surface of drivers side hinge appears to be a little thin at the bend. To be expected if the hinge was up or down position when painted



Passenger side hinge. Appears to have thin paint at the rear back raised area. We will see this more on other examples.  No light areas elsewhere on hinge from shadows

[J_Speegle]

67 #91x

Light to no body color at tip of drivers side hinge and light at forward bend lip



Shadow on back side of drivers side hinge arm and on the back side of body hing bracket suggesting IMHO the angle of paint application not related to arm being up or down position



Lower drivers side hinge area. Light to no coverage at the raised forward raise section of the hinge for some reason



Unlike drivers side this side has decent paint coverage to the end of the passenger side hinge




Decent coverage of body color on outer surface of the hinge arm unlike other side. May suggest the the painted applied the paint to the hinge on this side from both inside and outside angles while on the other side from the passenger side only. Does appear to have a paint shadow on the arm further down possibly suggesting on this car the arm being in the up position



Lack of good coverage right at the bend in the hinge arm on the bottom end. Some PO repair of the spring arm attachment point.



Shadow of the mounting bolts, bottom edge of the hinge and the rear raised areas could be a result of the angle (fairly straight on with the surface) the paint was applied. Sure it was not as noticable originally as the current surface rust shows a high contrast to the dark exterior color

[J_Speegle]

67  #80x

Similar stance or paint angle as we saw above from around the same time period. Possibly some painted/shift. Could almost be confused as the car above.


Another application from only the passenger side of this general area?  Back side of drivers side hinge arm little or no exterior color and notice the shadow created on the body hinge bracket so its consistent and possibly not from being in the down position



Angle not as straight on but some of the same results just to a lessor amount - passenger side




+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

67 #8x


Appears to be decent coverage on the upper end of the drivers side hinge arm




Passenger side this time with less and nice coverage. Rest of the visible arm looks like it got paint



More to come - Count looks like 29 pictures at the moment

[Bossbill]

A rich set of pics to look through, Jeff! I do appreciate that.

I don't know if I  can really inspect them over the next two days, and then I'm heading off to MN for the MCA meet.

If you don't hear back it's because I'm not near a computer and I need a big screen to really drill into them.

Thanks!

[J_Speegle]

Understand and no problem. Think we'll be here when you get back

Safe travels