Topic: bolt finishes

[1970shelbyguy]

 been looking at my osborn 70 body assembly manual - i see a lot of bolts that   call  for a  "S2" - off black (black phosphate?) finish   eg- hood lock support & radiator support ( inner pair and outer pair)   - yet bolt kits and every pic i've seen of those bolts have the same finish as the fender top bolts ( 6 pcs each side ) S39 finish (silver cad)  -- lower pair of fender bolts call for S2 and "A" pillar upper  bolt is "S2" also - is it a case of availability that plants used bolts of a different finish as per required by the prints.   i can see S2 bolts used up front because of being visible thru the grill  - would i be wrong in using S2 finish bolts where prints specify S2 yet S39 ( cad) is being utilized

[Bob Gaines]

been looking at my osborn 70 body assembly manual - i see a lot of bolts that   call  for a  "S2" - off black (black phosphate?) finish   eg- hood lock support & radiator support ( inner pair and outer pair)   - yet bolt kits and every pic i've seen of those bolts have the same finish as the fender top bolts ( 6 pcs each side ) S39 finish (silver cad)  -- lower pair of fender bolts call for S2 and "A" pillar upper  bolt is "S2" also - is it a case of availability that plants used bolts of a different finish as per required by the prints.   i can see S2 bolts used up front because of being visible thru the grill  - would i be wrong in using S2 finish bolts where prints specify S2 yet S39 ( cad) is being utilized

Well from a concours stand point the expected look is how the car left the factory in the case of bolt finishes. Sometimes the engineering drawings /assemblyline manuals or instructions are slightly different then what was actually done at a specific plant (Dearborn in 70 Shelby's case).

[jwc66k]

been looking at my osborn 70 body assembly manual - i see a lot of bolts that   call  for a  "S2" - off black (black phosphate?) finish   eg- hood lock support & radiator support ( inner pair and outer pair)   - yet bolt kits and every pic i've seen of those bolts have the same finish as the fender top bolts ( 6 pcs each side ) S39 finish (silver cad)  -- lower pair of fender bolts call for S2 and "A" pillar upper  bolt is "S2" also - is it a case of availability that plants used bolts of a different finish as per required by the prints.   i can see S2 bolts used up front because of being visible thru the grill  - would i be wrong in using S2 finish bolts where prints specify S2 yet S39 ( cad) is being utilized

There's more info needed. Who is the "bolt kit" supplier (the name on the bag, not who sold it)? The page of the 70 Body Assembly manual. Plant and assembly date of the Mustang in question.
"Generalities" do not get answers very often.
Jim

[1970shelbyguy]

the standard AMK under hood bolt kit contain all a s-39 ( silver cad)  finish-  1970  osborn body assembly manual ( orange) -  page 19 item "A" bolt  #57039-s2  , item "B" #57039-s2, item "C" #57039-s2 all bolts that fasten latch and support to radiator support-top and btm.  also page 23 item "E" # 57041-s2 - mounts upper radiator bracket to rad support ( big radiator)   page 34 same bolt #57041-s2 secures dash to cowl at different  locations  B, D, F , H -   & L - 57039 s-2-  all bolts denote s2 finish-  so why the difference in bolt finish  yet same part numbers ?- for a metuchen dec/69 boss

[Bob Gaines]

the standard AMK under hood bolt kit contain all a s-39 ( silver cad)  finish-  1970  osborn body assembly manual ( orange) -  page 19 item "A" bolt  #57039-s2  , item "B" #57039-s2, item "C" #57039-s2 all bolts that fasten latch and support to radiator support-top and btm.  also page 23 item "E" # 57041-s2 - mounts upper radiator bracket to rad support ( big radiator)   page 34 same bolt #57041-s2 secures dash to cowl at different  locations  B, D, F , H -   & L - 57039 s-2-  all bolts denote s2 finish-  so why the difference in bolt finish  yet same part numbers ?- for a metuchen dec/69 boss

Based on your forum name  and with no other car in your signature or indication in your post to suggest otherwise I can only assume that you are working on a 1970 Shelby. FYI a 1970 Shelby would use the 1969 assembly manual and not the orange 1970 manual. The 1970 Shelby is a re VINed 1969 model and chassis.

[1970shelbyguy]

 no as a matter of fact   i mentioned a  12/69 boss 302 metuchen -  and my friend's  1969 Osborn brown body assembly manual shows same s2 finishes for all the bolts i mentioned - he's restoring a may/69 boss 302   - yes i have a 70 gt500 -  it's restored - currently redoing my metuchen '70 boss - at the re-assembly stage-  i'm just questioning all the support & rad bracket area bolt finishes sold in the AMK kits ( s39) yet the  69 &70 osborn ford print body assembly manuals  state a s2 finish.   maybe typo errors on ford prints - i have seen some "restored" examples that have outer pair of bolts ( on the grill support bracket ) having a dark finish -s2 possibly- if you have a set of orig ford prints for 69 and 70  take a look  at the bolts i've mentioned.   even page 24 osborn orange body book ( 1970) shows lower battery tray  bolts having a  s39 ( silver cad) finish ! so they are identifying differences between s2 and s39 bolts

[jwc66k]

no as a matter of fact   i mentioned a  12/69 boss 302 metuchen -

Oh - I must have missed that.

  i'm just questioning all the support & rad bracket area bolt finishes sold in the AMK kits ( s39) yet the  69 &70 osborn ford print body assembly manuals  state a s2 finish.   

Shelby Mustangs were finished elsewhere after the Ford Assembly line was done. AMK kits, in general, were furnished for non-Shelby cars.
I suggest specific questions about your concerns addressed to Bob or Jeff.
Jim

[1970shelbyguy]

i'm not refering to my 70 shelby - it doesn't matter what mustang it is-  it's the osborn prints that are published in the  brown and orange manuals-  when a page says "D0ZB ALL"  that means ALL 1970 mustangs  for those that have a brown 69 or orange 70 body assembly manual take a closer look at hood latch support bolts.

[jwc66k]

Are you aware that AMK hardware kits were originally based on the "Ford Car Parts" books (aka MPC) and not the Osborn Assembly Manuals? That "little" quirk was determined by asking AMK directly. What Ford did, in most cases, when they published the MPC was consolidate the various finished hardware items into the latest configuration. That same approach also affected the actual hardware part itself. You are currently mixing oranges and apples in hardware finishes.

Shelby Mustangs were finished elsewhere after the Ford Assembly line was done. AMK kits, in general, were furnished for non-Shelby cars.

[1970shelbyguy]

 alright- so you're saying i shouldn't consider the osborn manuals as " cast in stone " correct - is so , then i'll just proceed with s-39 bolts from my  AMK kits . you'd think though an " updated 10-3-69 supersedes  9-19-69"  remark would reflect the required correct bolt finish -  so be it-   I'll  follow  Jeff's awesome pics on the "unrestored-survivor" 69/70  section.   

[jwc66k]

alright- so you're saying i shouldn't consider the osborn manuals as " cast in stone " correct - i

I didn't say that, in fact I "implied" that the AMK kit may be incorrect, at least for a different year. The Osborn manuals are considerably more accurate than Ford Car Parts (MPC).
Jim

[1970shelbyguy]

 pretty well all amk kits made for 69 are the same for 1970 - if the osborn prints are more accurate then why hasn't anybody in the past seen the discretion in the osborn print bolt finish and what amk produces. ?  might be just the few up on radiator bracket and grill support.  one difference are the shock tower braces to firewall bolts  69 gold cad  and 70 uses the s2 finish.

[kitdoctor]

alright- so you're saying i shouldn't consider the osborn manuals as " cast in stone " correct - is so , then i'll just proceed with s-39 bolts from my  AMK kits . you'd think though an " updated 10-3-69 supersedes  9-19-69"  remark would reflect the required correct bolt finish -  so be it-   I'll  follow  Jeff's awesome pics on the "unrestored-survivor" 69/70  section.

This was a very interesting point. Thanks for mentioning it.

[kitdoctor]

Are you aware that AMK hardware kits were originally based on the "Ford Car Parts" books (aka MPC) and not the Osborn Assembly Manuals? That "little" quirk was determined by asking AMK directly. What Ford did, in most cases, when they published the MPC was consolidate the various finished hardware items into the latest configuration. That same approach also affected the actual hardware part itself. You are currently mixing oranges and apples in hardware finishes.

Correction, this is what was a very interesting point.