Topic: 67 heater hose routing 289 A/C thermactor

[67gta289]

Looking for information on correct routing of heater hoses on 67 289 A/C thermactor.

I searched through several posts and knocked on the proverbial door a few times, but I'm left needing more.

From this post (http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?topic=10157.0) there is a picture that I've highlighted and attached here.

Realizing of course that it is a Dearborn non-thermactor car, but it is the closest thing I've found.

I have three questions:

1. On the supply hose I see that the carb choke spring (yellow box) has the bracket to contain the hose, but the hose appears to have been pulled out.  Should the hose run through it?  If so, would it continue over or under the PCV hose on its way to the heater shut off valve?

2. On the return hose, as indicated by the yellow arrows appears to be items that look like clamps.  Looking again, I see what could be two small vacuum lines or wires, and what looks like clamps could be electrical tape to connect these items together.   If there were no clamps, what keeps the hose from moving and touching the exhaust manifold?

3. Any idea how the routing was influenced by thermactor?  I suppose that the return hose would need to work its way around the air pump.  Any pictures?

The second picture is from the MPC illustrations book.  It does not depict a hose running along the face of the choke spring.

Thanks, John

[ruppstang]

I have a file that has pictures of Pete Morgan's 67 GTA 289 /W AC and Thermactor.  I do not want to post them with out his permission. Hopefully he will be a long. Is you car a 2V or a 4V?
 Here is a picture of our 67 GTA 2V with AC with out thermactor

[67gta289]

Thanks Marty.  C code 2V

[Deuce]

Attached is a pic taken from the 1967 Ford Preliminary Shop Manual, showing a drawing with the heater hose routing for non-Thermactor 289.

As we know, it gets crowded in there when the Thermactor hoses and AC hoses are layered on top of everything else.  Don't know if it's completely correct, however on my AC Thermactor car (C-code) with the ignition coil mounted on the intake manifold between the right valve cover and the carburetor:

1) I've kept the heater hose routing consistent with the drawing, with the return hose from the heater core routed over the PCV hose, through the choke bracket and to the forward nipple on the water pump.  Passing under the PCV hose is the Thermactor hose that is routed aft from the tee to the air gulp valve at the rear of the intake manifold.

2) The heater core inlet hose from the intake manifold nipple to the hot water valve on the cowl (AC car) is kept away from the exhaust manifold by routing outboard, between the air cleaner heat shield and the inner right shock tower.   

3) I can try to send a pic for how it looks on my car.

Here is an item from six months ago on the forum, about a 66 Thermactor car.  Which is one of the reasons I've kept the heater hose routing consistent since there's not much difference between 66 and 67 Thermactor systems:  http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?topic=15982.0

[67gta289]

Bob M (19667Bob) sent me a message pointing to the Electrical assembly manual page 83.   This provides a few answers and clues.

1. For the 289-2V and 289-4V the heater hose runs from the intake manifold pressure connection along the outer edge of the valve cover (engine side of the air cleaner heat riser) to the heater valve (pass side) and then from the heater valve to the passenger side heater core connection.

2a. 289-2V only: from the driver's side heater core connection up over the valve cover and through the bracket for the choke spring, passing over the intake manifold connection and down to the water pump suction connection.

2b. 289-4V only: from the driver's side heater core connection along the valve cover (engine side of the air cleaner heat riser), next to/below the supply hose, crossing over the front of the head and down to the water pump suction connection.

This is a later revision that lists the pre-formed hoses.

There is a detailed view of heater hose routing with thermactor.  It is the 4V version only so for the 2V there is some interpretation required.

There is a

[J_Speegle]

Not many original cars that have not had their heater hoses replaced and not sure how far I trust factory drawings showing what some illustrator or engineer thought would/should work.  But can feel the "fun" you've been experiencing

With that said. Could not find an example that suggested that the upper heater hose passed through the bracket at the carb as designed though I guess it could be forced. In most cases the heater hose from the intake ended up being the lower hose as they both traveled rearward towards the heater and control valve. This was likely due to the new location for the ignition coil and that odd intake water neck and ported vacuum switch combination used that year. If, one of the hoses did run that high it would have likely been the once from the water pump and then would be high enough to need to run under the PCV hose to preform a sloping mild curve

The PVC hose appears on the examples I have of passing over the two large Thermactor hoses on their way to the back fire valve but it doesn't look like the upper heater hose being routed that high up ) especially if it didn't pass through the carb bracket

I've never seen any straps, hoses nor brackets used to hold either heater hose between the engine and the heater or control valve

None of the hoses appear to have been left long enough to sag or hang near the exhaust manifold on the passenger side

Just what I found and can work out through the pictures

As far as Pete's car.... been allot of years since that car was built and i can't recall what we discussed or suggested back then

[Deuce]

These clues are very helpful.  Confirms that the hose from the intake manifold connection runs to the heater valve (passenger side), and the hose from the heater core (driver's side) runs to the water pump connection.

May require some trimming of heater hose lengths and a little bit of rerouting for both Thermactor and heater hoses to make it closer to correct.

Good info!

Thanks,

[67gtasanjose]

Bob M (19667Bob) sent me a message pointing to the Electrical assembly manual page 83.   This provides a few answers and clues.

1. For the 289-2V and 289-4V the heater hose runs from the intake manifold pressure connection along the outer edge of the valve cover (engine side of the air cleaner heat riser) to the heater valve (pass side) and then from the heater valve to the passenger side heater core connection.

2a. 289-2V only: from the driver's side heater core connection up over the valve cover and through the bracket for the choke spring, passing over the intake manifold connection and down to the water pump suction connection.

2b. 289-4V only: from the driver's side heater core connection along the valve cover (engine side of the air cleaner heat riser), next to/below the supply hose, crossing over the front of the head and down to the water pump suction connection.

This is a later revision that lists the pre-formed hoses.

There is a detailed view of heater hose routing with thermactor.  It is the 4V version only so for the 2V there is some interpretation required

Re: 2b from this quote

The struggle is REAL.
Osborn Assemble manual covers it but without a longer belt for the A/C-Smog Pump, the smog pump rides REALLY CLOSE to the water pump pre-formed hose. Without a 2nd pre-formed bend, or an "S-shaped" end, that hose tries to kink getting around the smog pump. My solution was to switch out how the hoses stacked along the lower edge of the valve cover, with the water pump hose over top of the intake hose. This relieved the tendency for that water pump hose to kink.

As far as the 2-barrel C-codes running through the choke bracket on the carburetor, that may be true but with the ignition coil in the path, there may be some interference involved...probably less interference then routing both hoses down the outside of the valve cover (A-code option) but the drawings DID show the 2-barrel (C-codes) someplace in Osborn Manual...I am just not sure where but I believe it was in the ELECTRICAL manual, for AC installation.

[gtamustang]

I have a file that has pictures of Pete Morgan's 67 GTA 289 /W AC and Thermactor.  I do not want to post them with out his permission. Hopefully he will be a long. Is you car a 2V or a 4V?
 Here is a picture of our 67 GTA 2V with AC with out thermactor

Marty,

You are welcome to share pictures of that car if it can help clarify any points, now and in the future (yeah, I still lurk here)

Regards,
Pete Morgan

[J_Speegle]

Re: 2b from this quote

The struggle is REAL.
Osborn Assemble manual covers it but without a longer belt for the A/C-Smog Pump, the smog pump rides REALLY CLOSE to the water pump pre-formed hose. Without a 2nd pre-formed bend, or an "S-shaped" end, that hose tries to kink getting around the smog pump. My solution was to switch out how the hoses stacked along the lower edge of the valve cover, with the water pump hose over top of the intake hose. This relieved the tendency for that water pump hose to kink.

As far as the 2-barrel C-codes running through the choke bracket on the carburetor, that may be true but with the ignition coil in the path, there may be some interference involved...probably less interference then routing both hoses down the outside of the valve cover (A-code option) but the drawings DID show the 2-barrel (C-codes) someplace in Osborn Manual...I am just not sure where but I believe it was in the ELECTRICAL manual, for AC installation.

Don't believe the coil placement was any big challenge since everything passes over it though getting to it later to service was not as easy as a non-thermactor car. You can make out the coil in picture #1 and #3 pictures below

Also the "valley" between the passenger side valve cover and the intake/carb gets really busy/full when you consider that the thermactor hose from the T to the valve at the back of the intake runs along there also

Here are a few supporting pictures showing the heater hose retainers and related parts. Some of these pictures are from the Unrestored Picture section and were  not posted when this discussion first started. Will include shortened  VINs for reference



7R03C1883xxx Heater hose had been replaced though it most certainly ran through the carb bracket



7R02C1721xxx Heater hose still positioned in holder



7R01C1824xx Unfortunately air cleaner still in place though the hose appears to be heading towards the carb bracket



7R01C1977xx Heater hose shut off valve



Of course have a fair number of examples to post more if needed depending on what details are needed. Unfortunately fair number have air cleaners in the way of some details