Topic: 65-67 group 22 Autolite Battery Discussion

[Bob Gaines]

Bob, I'm sorry I misunderstood what was written by others. So the real problem isn't in the judges, it is more at the MCA level? I'm certainly not trying to get anybody upset, I also didn't realize people (restorers) who spend countless hours and countless dollars to bring their cars to a level of excellence, would get upset that MCA might have a rule change to help bring their car up to a higher standard of authenticity. I am a Newbie here, so the last thing I wish to do is step on anybody's toes. I only wished to help bring about more discussion on a need to have the correct battery available to purchase. If owners are willing to Pony up $250 fee/show to cover the cost of having a lift at Nationals for authenticity, then I cannot see that they would be too upset in getting a correct (around $250) battery that actually starts the car, thus adding points. Maybe I am just naive in what I think. Again, I hope you accept my apologies. 

You did not upset me and I am glad the for the opportunity to explain in better detail. As members of MCA we are all "at the MCA level" but as judges we can only make recommendations to the board who have the power to make changes. Some judges have more pull with those board members then others . Sadly I am of the no pull variety and can only help bring facts like this to light and voice a opinion . It is up to others to use the information to make changes for the clubs benefit.

[67gtasanjose]

I am considering making a note in judge sheet battery section that their reproduction battery is incorrect with out any deduction. That way at least the owners are aware of it and are not surprised if latter it becomes a deduction. May be then they will start asking vendors for the early 22F and 24F.

Has this notion helped much yet? Have the Judging Teams been making notes on "Battery Correctness" since this discussion went to sleep a few years ago? (I know the topic of the battery has surfaced again since, though the notation on "Judging sheets" is what I am asking about, wondering if it has helped to get a Repro Battery going or if it has also gone to sleep too)

[ruppstang]

I have not recently judged a car that would have used a group 22, so have not made any notations. I have not heard any talk about the early batteries being reproduced recently.

[carlite65]

there is an mca judges meeting after the myrtle beach show. i am quite sure this topic will resurface..............now where it goes is anyone's guess.

[67gtasanjose]

I have not recently judged a car that would have used a group 22, so have not made any notations. I have not heard any talk about the early batteries being reproduced recently.

How could we know unless you looked for date codes on a battery tray or maybe had a Marti Report on hand?

My heavily loaded with options Coupe came with a 22F and the date code found on the tray confirms it. Maybe it's an anomaly of sorts, I don't know because I would have assumed that a car with factory installed Select-Aire, even as a 289, would have been originally equipped with a Heavy Duty Battery but a H.D. battery isn't specified on the Marti Report either.

I USED to think it was because it was a Thermactor car and there wasn't enough room for a 24F and to have the filter canister for the Thermactor in place but earlier in this thread, Bob mentioned a 24F would fit on a California car. I haven't yet seen images of a 24F in place with Thermactor but I no reason to doubt his statement on the subject. 

[Bob Gaines]

How could we know unless you looked for date codes on a battery tray or maybe had a Marti Report on hand?

My heavily loaded with options Coupe came with a 22F and the date code found on the tray confirms it. Maybe it's an anomaly of sorts, I don't know because I would have assumed that a car with factory installed Select-Aire, even as a 289, would have been originally equipped with a Heavy Duty Battery but a H.D. battery isn't specified on the Marti Report either.

I USED to think it was because it was a Thermactor car and there wasn't enough room for a 24F and to have the filter canister for the Thermactor in place but earlier in this thread, Bob mentioned a 24F would fit on a California car. I haven't yet seen images of a 24F in place with Thermactor but I no reason to doubt his statement on the subject.

The 22F was the base battery for 65-67 Mustangs with all engines but the 390. Because of this the default should be to assume it got a 22 f instead of assuming it got a 24 first. Yes a 22 F seems to me to be a anomaly on a 289 air car from what I have seen and investigated .   

[ruppstang]

My Marti report calls out a HD battery on the 11-04-66 SJ convertible. It still should have had the yellow caps though.
Marty

[Bob Gaines]

My Marti report calls out a HD battery on the 11-04-66 SJ convertible. It still should have had the yellow caps though.
Marty

Marty, all indications suggest that the heavy duty batteries group 24 batteries got the red caps. The base group 24 battery came with yellow caps 65-67and it had a lower capacity. I have not heard of or seen a 65-67 group 22 with other then yellow caps.

[ruppstang]

So I am understanding this correctly. 65-67
A group 22 had a yellow caps. If it was optioned to a heavy duty it moved up to a group 24 and a red cap.
If it was a 67 S code it got a group 24 with yellow caps and if it was optioned up to a heavy duty it got the group 24 red caps.
Is that correct?

[Bob Gaines]

So I am understanding this correctly. 65-67
A group 22 had a yellow caps. If it was optioned to a heavy duty it moved up to a group 24 and a red cap.
If it was a 67 S code it got a group 24 with yellow caps and if it was optioned up to a heavy duty it got the group 24 red caps.
Is that correct?

You are correct to my understanding on the 65-67 battery subject. Not to confuse things but to add, the 68 and up group 22 and 24 batteries which had a different design case from the 65-67 all got red caps as far as far I know. I don't believe I have ever seen or heard about a 68-70 battery with yellow caps from the factory.

[ruppstang]

I judged a 68 GTCS once that had a group 24 that had green caps. Any idea what that may have been? Service replacement?

[J_Speegle]

I judged a 68 GTCS once that had a group 24 that had green caps. Any idea what that may have been? Service replacement?

I've seen green caps on service and ag batteries. Think they represented a very inexpensive/cheap part of the battery line.

We had an owner that had a 68 KR that we judged for years at MCA (for the grill badge) He would change out his caps to green to match the exterior color every so often to see if we were paying attention or just to have fun with us. He would do that normally over the winter. Think he just got bored at times, would see something on someone elses car in a magazine and change his even though he was getting a gold at every show before that.   

[Bob Gaines]

Gold caps too if I am not mistaken on 68-70 . I believe the gold indicated a higher capacity battery. It was a over the counter service item. I sure BP has some in his magic attic or on display.

[J_Speegle]

Few examples of the "other" versions not all Mustang applications. And they are the 68-up versions with the warranty punch outs Notice that the two green examples lack the Extra High Capacity STA FULL logo on the top and side of case











Think I'm going to split this topic since its gone towards a discussion of batterys verses a Wanted ad for one.  Should have done this long ago   

[rcombs]

NOTE: The following posts were originally a different thread that has been merged with an earlier thread to keep similar discussions together
______________________________________________________

Well, I got my 1966 out of storage Saturday. My Repo Autolite battery had been on the tender all winter, but wouldn't start the car. I got a jump and got the car home. Now I need to decide what to do. I have been looking at cutting the case and replacing the battery inside with a new one. The only thing that bothers me is the Repo is not correct either. I was thinking that what the owners of the older cars need is a correct case that we can stuff with a modern battery as required. Has anyone looked into getting this done? If not does anyone have an original that they would be willing to sell to try and get this done? Just some thoughts.

Thanks,
Rick