Topic: 65 GT Maybe? Something doesn't "smell right"

[67gtasanjose]

Today, I have been asked to build/buy/install a "Driver Style" Dual Exhaust on a 65 GT. (I own a Muffler Shop)

Beginning on Try-Y headers to the rear GT outlets.

I see no evidence that this car came with dual exhaust with GT outlets except the hack-job presently in place.

No rear seat floorpan hangers

No rear frame hangers near rear shackles either.

Maybe not a GT?

Data plate details below, VIN matches LH front apron numbers, there is some eveidence of minor frontal collision work (without looking hard)
NOT an exceptionally real sweet ride, but a faily good looking 40-footer, shiney Raven Black coupe.

I'll upload some images in a little while.

Data Plate:
65B  A  D6  06S  51  1  5
5R07A2179**

[rocket289k]

Based on the lack of evidence of a factory dual exhaust installation as you detailed in your post above it's not a factory '65 GT.  Only factory GTs (A code or K-code) and non-GT K-codes came from the factory with dual exhaust.  A non-GT "A" code came from the factory with a single exhaust (which over the years are typically removed with a dual exhaust installed in its place). 

One point of confusion though based on the date plate you provided:

"65B" denotes a Coupe with Pony Interior however the trim code "D6" is supposed to White Vinyl with Black Appointments, Standard Interior.

PS - It would also need the larger master cylinder for the manual disc brakes that are part of the GT package.  In addition, the front sway bar would be 13/16" and it would have a quick ratio steering box with the tag one of the following codes:  (Code: HCC-AX for Manual Steering and HCC-AW for Power Steering)

Regards,

Ron

[67gtasanjose]

data plate says it should be a crinkle black appointed white standard interior in one place while at another place it says it is supposed to have the pony interior. I'm no expert on the 65 GT's. I 'm fairly sure it's a clone of sorts.

No matter, I wouldn't mind trying to make this look a little bit more authentic at least in the back area of the job if possible. MOSTLY, because this will make the install easier. The crap that's in there now...

[rockhouse66]

Repros of the reinforced muffler hanger brackets that go under the rear seat are available if you want to improve the install.

[67gtasanjose]

A few pics:

[rocket289k]

Repros of the reinforced muffler hanger brackets that go under the rear seat are available if you want to improve the install.

In addition you can now get the proper reproductions of the muffler hanger floor retainer (after you've installed the floor pan reinforcements) so that the mufflers are attached in the correct location and the correct type of hardware.  Bare in mind adding those two pieces to the car will lead a more causal observer of the car would lead them to believe that this is a factory GT (if they didn't check for the other '65 GT attributes).

[67gtasanjose]

OBVIOUSLY, not going CONCOURS in total job here.

The wrong rivets in the data plate with conficting info seems to be one of those "smelly" issues. It does have the round GT style guages, it does have the KH disc brakes up front and even a disc brake pedal pad, they installed a dual reservoir master cylinder (like a 67) ...Sway bar switched out for aftermarket, lots of change-outs away from stock like a 5-speed. Still has the 3.00 open rear end (or the tag anyways).

If I go with the stock floor supports and stock style hangers, I'll probably also need to move that brake hose over too, correct?

[rocket289k]

OBVIOUSLY, not going CONCOURS in total job here.

The wrong rivets in the data plate with conficting info seems to be one of those "smelly" issues. It does have the round GT style guages, it does have the KH disc brakes up front and even a disc brake pedal pad, they installed a dual reservoir master cylinder (like a 67) ...Sway bar switched out for aftermarket, lots of change-outs away from stock like a 5-speed. Still has the 3.00 open rear end (or the tag anyways).

If I go with the stock floor supports and stock style hangers, I'll probably also need to move that brake hose over too, correct?

LOL - re concours quote. +1 to needing to move the brake hose over as well with the installation of the stock floor supports and stock style hangers.

PS - Is the tag still on the steering box?

[67gtasanjose]

PS - Is the tag still on the steering box?

Will have to look tomorrow, at home now.

[J_Speegle]

Tons of clues in your pictures and findings you shared

It isn't and wasn't . Wouldn't waste the time to pull the rear seat to take a look for anything but some change it its there

Sure you can keep looking but why - sure you have plenty of other things to do.

[CharlesTurner]

Single exhaust brackets still in place on the frame rails.  No doubt this was a single exhaust car from the factory.

[Richard P.]

The rear brake line doesn't appear to be for a 1965 GT Mustang.

[67gtasanjose]

Yes, it would seem basically 100% of things mentioned so far have failed to prove out as this being a genuine GT. Looking at the gear box is as far as I'm willing to go at this time...There is no point. Gear box date coded consistent with projected build date (5D09C) and has an ID # of HCC )19:1, non-GT)

Since NOT a GT yet has the rear openings in the valance, with a garden variety (somewhat unusable) trumpet outlets, who sells a good usable NON-Concours type hanger set that will at least tie things down simply? ...and recommendations of a pair of decent Trumpets? I see Drake has two types listed, has anyone tried the 2-inch set he makes?

[67gtasanjose]

The PLOT thickens:
So since this is NOT a GT, and I need to build an estimate to accomplish a job I find suitable to sign my name to, I need a few more items than originally known before actually seeing the car.

a.) owner never told me it was a GT (and I didn't ask, I asked owner to bring it in before I would estimate it)
b.) owner just bought the car and swapped in the 302 & 5 speed, not driven anywhere yet except to my shop.
c.) previous owner never swapped an out-of-state title and is dragging feet on getting it done
d.) previous owner's son-in-law, a friend of mine, helped out with the engine swap ALSO, previous owner is current owner's brother.
e.) I felt I should talk to my "friend" first to find out if anyone already knew this WAS NOT a GT.
f.) EVERYONE INVOLVED SUPPOSEDLY BELIEVES (or now, believed)) IT IS A GT 

NOT too fun being the "bearer of bad news", I'm having my "friend" tell the new proud owner the news (not me) I supplied him with a few of the reasons mentioned here as why I feel it is NOT a GT. I was then asked what I thought the car was worth as it is. I said maybe 10K, but only because it's not heavily rusted and mostly straight. I also said it is only worth what it can sells for as a clone. He said that if it's worth 10K, then nobody will be too awfully upset. Apparently, this is around what was paid for it. I told my friend "good luck" with passing on the news and, by the way, tell him to bring me some money to get started

[rocket289k]

Yes, it would seem basically 100% of things mentioned so far have failed to prove out as this being a genuine GT. Looking at the gear box is as far as I'm willing to go at this time...There is no point. Gear box date coded consistent with projected build date (5D09C) and has an ID # of HCC )19:1, non-GT)

Since NOT a GT yet has the rear openings in the valance, with a garden variety (somewhat unusable) trumpet outlets, who sells a good usable NON-Concours type hanger set that will at least tie things down simply? ...and recommendations of a pair of decent Trumpets? I see Drake has two types listed, has anyone tried the 2-inch set he makes?

Scott Drake's sells 3 tips

1 - straight 2" pipe Trumpet (no bends)
2 - an economy exhaust tip trumpet (factory bends)
3 - concours exhaust tip trumpet

I only have experience using the Concours  exhaust tip trumpet.  It's a very nice reproduction part (great welds, good quality stainless steel, proper fit of the louver to the pipe etc.).  I can't vouch for the other two tips they sell.

Ron