Topic: Need photos of October '69-built 1970 Dearborn Mach 1 front sound deadener

[Cobrajet428]

Can someone please post or point me to photos of where the front fender area / wheel well sound deadener should be applied for this plant and time? Sorry, tried searching, but couldn't find.

[KevinK]

Nice special effects!  It makes it much easier to understand.

So the batch color would be the same paint which the bottom (floors) was painted with?

[J_Speegle]

So the batch color would be the same paint which the bottom (floors) was painted with?

Can not guarantee that - may be a slightly different color but we know they were applied at different times and unless the system was replumbed  at the plant between 69 and 70 then the source of the two were from different tanks.

On the one car used as an example the firewall forward and the color reward looked similar. Wish I had access to more unrestored examples of 70 to clean and  take samples from

[Cobrajet428]

Jeff,

Thank you for the excellent information about body color/batch/primer.
However, my question was about the application of sound deadener in the front wheelhouse (the whole area left/right/above/behind the front wheels).
Do you have photos that highlight the front sound deadener?

Also, I've read your article on using Spectrum Sludge to duplicate some of the original texture.
The photos don't seem to show its use in the front. Have you used this up front? Does it seem to work well for that area or do use different materials of techniques?

[J_Speegle]

However, my question was about the application of sound deadener in the front wheelhouse (the whole area left/right/above/behind the front wheels).
Do you have photos that highlight the front sound deadener?

Opps sorry - will do some and post . Pulled the earlier illustrations

Also, I've read your article on using Spectrum Sludge to duplicate some of the original texture.
The photos don't seem to show its use in the front. Have you used this up front? Does it seem to work well for that area or do use different materials of techniques?

In the photos I posted with the project I was using the Sludge on it was not applied there (over paint) since the car was a Shelby. Those cars didn't get that application since they didn't have any fenders on those cars at Dearborn. If applied the concern and likely byproduct of their application (lots of chunky overspray on other parts of the car) would have caused problems and would have made AO Smiths job more difficult. Sludge was used under the paints as a seam sealer in the front wheel wells along the firewall to inner fender seams as well as  frame to torque boxes


Others have applied the Sludge with a gun/applicator and have responded in other threads their success and that they were pleased with the end product

Will get on that and post.

[J_Speegle]

Ok hope this helps and is more on focus this time

Front wheel well sound deadener application for a Fall 69 Dearborn Mustang


I've used to examples from the time period to give a general idea and a little variation

Highlighting was added to show where the worker covered with sound deadener. Worker stood from below the car and sprayed up and inward to apply the material









Section of firewall has been cut away and the splash shields have been removed. They would have been covered during the application


















The backside of the front fender sort of ties it all together. You can see where the (highlighted in green) front wheel well application wrapped around the back side of the headlight area, splash shield onto the front fender. The reddish (highlight) pass from the rear section of the wheel well over the splash shields and onto the rear section of the fender.  Then an additional pass over the bottom of the fender with the purple highlighted area. Not easy to explain 3D applications







Hope this helps and is more suited to your needs.

[Cobrajet428]

Jeff,

THANK YOU!

This is *exactly* what I was seeking, and your explanation does make sense of the 3-D application. I had no idea the inside surface of the outer fenders were coated to that degree, as I had the impression there was just a quick pass made across the underside of the top surface of the fender. Looks like they used a real wide spray pattern, too.

I'll do my best to duplicate what you've shown, and sincerely appreciate what you're doing to document production details and variances!

[J_Speegle]

This is *exactly* what I was seeking, and your explanation does make sense of the 3-D application. I had no idea the inside surface of the outer fenders were coated to that degree, as I had the impression there was just a quick pass made across the underside of the top surface of the fender. Looks like they used a real wide spray pattern, too.

Glad we finally got to what you were looking for - again sorry for not getting it the first time

As for the wider pattern - might be the result of just a shorter worker (not as much reach) as some others. Sure it was not one of the prime jobs on the line - but it was a paycheck

[G Wood]

I am ready to perform the same steps on my car, just curious on what product you will use. I did use the Spectrum Sludge on the interior and it worked well but had not decided for the fender areas.

Thanks

Garth

[Cobrajet428]

I am ready to perform the same steps on my car, just curious on what product you will use. I did use the Spectrum Sludge on the interior and it worked well but had not decided for the fender areas.

Thanks

Garth

I'm using a Westley's brushable undercoat product that is reduced with lacquer thinner to allow it to be sprayed with a "body schutz-like" gun. Like so many things now, the Westley's stuff may no longer be available. This is what I used on my rear wheelwells over 20 years ago (sealed with epoxy primer and oversprayed body color) and they look very close to factory.

I've started on the work today. Just came in to review reference materials. Will report back with results and specifics depending on outcome.

[J_Speegle]

I'm using a Westley's brushable undercoat product that is reduced with lacquer thinner to allow it to be sprayed with a "body schutz-like" gun. Like so many things now, the Westley's stuff may no longer be available. This is what I used on my rear wheelwells over 20 years ago (sealed with epoxy primer and oversprayed body color) and they look very close to factory.

Originally (from all the ones I've seen) by 69 & 70 primers were applied prior to sound deadener in the rear wheel well   and of course the front and floor (on Mach I's also)

[Cobrajet428]

Jeff - thanks for pointing out that detail. I did in fact epoxy prime before applying the rear wheel well and floorpan undercoating, then applied epoxy primer thinned as a sealer over the top of the undercoating to prevent bleedthrough into the topcoat paint. It worked very well and has stayed in great condition now for over 20 years.

Finishing a little cleanup on the front wheelhouse area tomorrow and will then post photos of results.

[Cobrajet428]

Better late than never ... photos of the finished results attached.

The product used was "Westley's Brush On Rubberized Undercoating" shot with an Undercoating Spray Gun bought recently online from TCP Global Corp. From what I can tell, the Westley's product is no longer sold, but it appears to made from Tar (and god knows what else). Something like this, also from TCP might work, but don't just take my word for it, by all means test first: http://www.amazon.com/Approved-Brushable-Asphalt-Bitumen-Base-Undercoating/dp/B002HOG28G

I reduced the product with garden-variety Medium Speed Lacquer Thinner to about the consistency of a thick cake mix. If you reduce it too much, you'll lose the texture. If you don't reduce it enough, it'll only sputter out of the gun. The air pressure needs to be set HIGH in order to move the heavy material. I found 100 psi about right. Less causes more sputtering, more causes the overspray to really scatter. Best technique is to set the pressure to 100psi, add a little lacquer thinner to the product, stir in well, and spray on a scrap test panel. Repeat adding thinner, stirring, test spraying until satisfied.  When first sprayed, it'll be very "peaky" looking, but know that as the solvent dries out of it, the peaks will flatten out to quite a degree. So, you want to shoot for as much texture as possible.

No matter what you do, this stuff spatters and cleanup is a drag. Protect yourself and your working areas. You are warned.

Once the stuff is applied to the car, leave it alone for a day, then follow up by cleaning off excessive spatter. Factory original sound deadener didn't spatter/speckle like this stuff does, but the overspray can be cleaned off with Turtle Wax Bug & Tar remover to bring things back looking right. The remover worked amazingly well and doesn't harm paint. Just don't leave the sound deadener to dry more than a day before cleaning up the overspray or you'll have a real difficult time, but you also don't want to get in there cleaning much sooner unless you want to ruin your work and end up with it coating you too!

It took about 1/2 gallon to do both sides, but I applied it pretty conservatively as that's all I had to work with.

[J_Speegle]

Thanks for sharing - and the pictures. Really like the splatters on the bumper arm/mount to the drivers side frame rail

What to use has always been an issue. You find something that works or at least you figure out how to make it work, then they reformulate or make it "legal" and then its doesn't work or look like it did.   Others have posted that they have been using the Sludge product and have a friend that likes the 3M stuff though I've never had success with it.

Some/many have found that if you cool the product before spraying they sometimes have a better build (stick longer before they sag - or just for more body/thickness)

Since you provided pictures. Was that pink mark on your upper A arms on those items when you got the car?

[G Wood]

Jeff:

Thanks for the update on product, I am running out of Sludge and was holding off buying more if there was another product that seemed to work better for this application.