Topic: 65-66 original u-joints - any pictures?

[J_Speegle]

Interesting - Never found an original with the large bar across the center section on a San Jose car. All had the same hallowed out shape on both sides. Since many of those are marked Ford I think you may have collected some replacements rather than assembly line versions

The inclusion of the '65 and '66 Comet/Falcon/Fairlane/Mustang shop manuals may have been a mistake or a legacy from earlier versions and removed once found. Just a possibility IMHO as we try to get an handle on a very often replaced item after 50 plus years

[C9ZZ-16228-B]

Jeff - Only the OLR Ford/Dana u-joints are hollowed out both sides.  The Borg Warner ILR u-joints have the cross shaft, whether it was drilled out and plugged or not. 

The u-joints in the left and center columns are definitely assembly line, and none of the u-joints in the pictures are marked Ford...

[J_Speegle]

Sorry bottom left corner one appears to have FORD in the bottom picture on my monitor. Shadows??

The u-joints in the left and center columns are definitely assembly line, and none of the u-joints in the pictures are marked Ford...

How can the U joint with the retainer strap be definitely assembly line since it would not have been installed with the strap?  Bottom center column

[C9ZZ-16228-B]

They were installed with the cap strap, at least the Borg Warner u-joints were.  I agree I haven't seen any of the OLR Ford/Dana u-joints with a strap.  There are assembly line examples posted earlier in this thread, and i have several examples still on driveshafts.  I'll have to check in the morning but i'm pretty sure i have an ungreasable joint in a driveshaft that has the strap on it still.

The joints are cast with "9493J  URD".

[J_Speegle]

They were installed with the cap strap, at least the Borg Warner u-joints were.  I agree I haven't seen any of the OLR Ford/Dana u-joints with a strap.  There are assembly line examples posted earlier in this thread,............

Believe you will find that the one earlier example wasn't installed in a car nor from the assembly line. The other was rebuilt, not yet used.

Kind of hard installing the U joint with the strap still in place.

Workers had to remove them (early service replacements also had them on them) before they could install them in the cars on the line. This would have been done when the yoke was installed in the driveline and placed on the dolly (with one rear strap still attached) so that it would be available to the guys in the pit as the body was lowered from above onto the waiting driveline, exhaust and rearend assembles awaiting them.

[C9ZZ-16228-B]

Why is it hard to install the ujoint with the strap in place?  It's not on the caps that go into the driveshaft.  And why would they have to remove the strap holding the caps on?  If the ujoint is installed with the strap facing forward it's not in the way of anything, and if it's facing rearward the yoke on the rear end is cast to allow for it. 
In your third paragraph, are you referring to the slip yoke or the pinion yoke?  And what exactly are you referring to as the driveline?  I don't mean any disrespect, I'm just trying to understand what you're saying.  Or maybe I wasn't clear that the strap was only on the 11/8" caps on the rear u-joint meant for the rear end yoke?  The ujoints in the pictures I posted are front (top) and rear (bottom) sets from three driveshafts.

[J_Speegle]

Not trying to be argumentive - guess we're both limited by the written word and other challanges commuicating from afar.

Why is it hard to install the ujoint with the strap in place? 
It's not on the caps that go into the driveshaft. 

Guess that is where we're not seeing the others perspective. I've always had to remove the caps to install a U joint in the driveline, transmission yoke and though don't have to at the rear would remove the retaining strap from the caps so that it can be installed if I ever used some of the early replacements.

I can't install a U joint (guess just not a method I'm aware of) between the transmission yoke and driveline with the strap on. U joints are front or rear only they have different applications. On one car they might be correct for the front connection while on another the rear.

And why would they have to remove the strap holding the caps on?
If the ujoint is installed with the strap facing forward it's not in the way of anything, and if it's facing rearward the yoke on the rear end is cast to allow for it.

As said above if installing in the driveline or trans yoke I only know of methods of installation where the caps have to be removed so that the U joint can be situated between the eyes and the caps installed from the outer surface towards the U joint and seated.



 

In your third paragraph, are you referring to the slip yoke or the pinion yoke?  And what exactly are you referring to as the driveline?  I don't mean any disrespect, I'm just trying to understand what you're saying.

Red arrow - driveline  Green arrow transmission yoke.





Rear end yoke

Or maybe I wasn't clear that the strap was only on the 11/8" caps on the rear u-joint meant for the rear end yoke?  The ujoints in the pictures I posted are front (top) and rear (bottom) sets from three driveshafts.

I think this is where we separated. I'm mentally comparing the NOS U joints we've seen with the straps to the pictures that your showing with the straps. But your suggesting/sharing that you believe the straps on your examples were different and for a specific location.

Yours are the first I've heard of installled with the straps left in place. We do have pictures of the rear (don't know what size but guess we could guess and look them up) of the straps being in that location prior to the installation of the driveline in the car originally.  Something to "chew over "   

[C9ZZ-16228-B]

I'm sorry if you thought i meant all the u-joint caps came strapped.  Just the rear caps that fit into the rear end yoke so they don't fall off the u-joint spider before final installation into the car.  You can see in the picture you posted of the rear yoke how there's a casting recess where the strap ends would be when the u-joint is installed into the rear yoke. 

The driveshafts were assembled (slip yoke, front u-joint, shaft, rear u-joint) and balanced at the respective manufacturers (either Borg Warner or Ford/Dana) and delivered complete ready to install at the final assembly plants, correct?  I'm assuming they're assembled at different locations because everything is different between the two versions of driveshafts used in 65-66 (the two versions being inside and outside lock ring), even the balancing weights. 

[C9ZZ-16228-B]

Here's a few more pictures i took of u-joints:

This picture is a Borg Warner ILR joint next to a Ford/Dana OLR joint.  You can kind of see the Ford oval and the Dana diamond in the center of the joint on the right.  I have other examples that show the markings more clearly.  Both of these are designated 1260 u-joints.  The 1260 OLR u-joint was used in 65-66 for any OLR applications, and according to the MPC in '67 as well for 6 cylinder automatics and 289's except hipos.

[CharlesTurner]

I don't have much to add to the discussion other than the only time I have ever seen the straps welded to the cups is on service replacement drive-shafts.

[J_Speegle]

I wonder (or believe at this juncture) that the straps were likely meant to be removed on the line (reason why we don't find the straps on original cars) but sometimes they were missed and left - the reason you've found some examples that way.

Just trying to come up with a reason and answer for what we have.

Do recall seeing service replacements with two straps and zert fitting provisions in the past.

[awhtx]

I wonder (or believe at this juncture) that the straps were likely meant to be removed on the line (reason why we don't find the straps on original cars) but sometimes they were missed and left - the reason you've found some examples that way.

Just trying to come up with a reason and answer for what we have.

Are there no assembly line workers still living that could answer questions like this one?

[J_Speegle]

Are there no assembly line workers still living that could answer questions like this one?

Not that I've heard of or talked to. Could likely find one that would tell us either way if you asked the questions in a leading manner but that really would not help.  In general we would need to find someone that set up the line, a manager or someone specific that worked that particular station at all three plants. In general allot of employees, from the ones I've talked to, only knew what happened at a station they were assigned to, maybe what happened before and after that and normally remember the interactions between workers (factory drama) the best

Unfortunately we've lost allot of them in the last ten years