Topic: 66 door speaker and grill attaching hardware?

[7Lscjracer]

I'm looking for the correct hardware to install the door speakers and grills in a 66 that was factory equipped with an am 8 track.
This nos grill on ebay illustrates something different than the sheet metal thread screws the mustang vendors typically flog.
Have a zoom in look at the machine screw from the back of the grill pic.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/66-Mustang-NOS-AM-8-Track-Door-Panel-Speaker-Grill-RARE-/170978151824?pt=Vintage_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item27cf178d90&vxp=mtr

Perhaps service part hardware differred from assembly line hardware in this case, so I should mention the car was San Jose built.

[drummingrocks]

I have a December-built Dearborn '66 with the 8-track option, and I don't remember the screws looking like that.  I seem to remember they were a sheet metal screw.

[7Lscjracer]

I looked at some more listings, and Andrew has several grills for sale with the same screws as the nos grill.
Seems service part vs assembly line isn't a factor in this case, and the screws in the listing pics are correct.
The car is at the shop now so I can't check, but both the speaker and grill use the same 4 screws right?
Not 4 for a speaker and another 4 for a grill?
I recall 4 not 8 screw holes in the door, but it's been along time since I looked.
I guess there should be some nylon type inserts or clip nuts in the door for the screws to thread into?
AMK lists this sort of stuff for 67, but not 66.

[jwc66k]

According to the Osborn 66 Mustang Electrical Manual, pg 51, there is no attaching hardware, the grill has four studs that push thru the 4 door mounting holes into retainers in the speaker. It is like the fire wall pad retainers in concept, push and lock. That's not to say that the factory got smart and used a different method. If you want better looking hardware, find some oval head machine screws and nuts in AMK's catalog.
Jim

[7Lscjracer]

Now it all makes sense, the "retainers" in the speakers is what's missing then.
The blown original speakers have been out of the car for years, but I kept them and just dug them out and had a look.
A circular mark on the back of the speaker where each retainer used to be is evident.
I looked up speakers on ebay, and Andrew has a speaker for sale that clearly shows the retainers in place having an internal machine screw thread.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1966-Mustang-Fastback-Convert-GT-Shelby-ORIG-8-TRACK-AM-FM-STEREO-DOOR-SPEAKER-/160940111294?hash=item2578c735be&item=160940111294&pt=Vintage_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr

So now I'll be shopping for 8 of those special screws and retainers.
I bought a replacement pair of 4X8's from Greg at turnswitch.com
The only ones on the market that I know of with exact fitment AND the proper impedance for vintage radios with stock electronics.

[MyRed66GT]

I'm looking for the same screws for my SJ built 66 GT. I have the original grilles and have obtained an NOS pair of speakers. I have some of the original screws but they are in bad shape. They are indeed machine screws that fit into inserts in the speakers. Let me know who makes these so I can also grab a set!

[7Lscjracer]

So your nos speakers are supplied with the inserts?
Do they just press in, or are they bonded by some method.
On my original speakers, the water shield is glued (seems like) to the speaker frame, and round circle marks on the shield (clean spots) are evidence of where the retainers used to be.
I think I have a solution for finding replacement screws.
A fastener house in town sells piece meal and for cash, it's just a question of my knowing the head type, length and thread size.
They'll be stainless steel though, so although the heads will be the exact phillips dome head countersink shape, they'll have to go on a buffer to shine up like chrome plated originals.
They won't have the little taper at the tip though.
I'd be happy to pick up a bunch if you can post the particulars of the screw thanks.

[Andrew@MagMustangs]

The Screws are right between 1 1/16" and 1 1/8" Overall Length. I'm sorry I can't give you the thread count. I'm not good at counting all those threads with my eyes. There are just the 4 screws used per speaker. The nuts(inserts) are part of the speaker frame and the speaker mounts inside the door shell and the trim grille mounts outside.

The Water Shield IS Glued to the speaker frame with one screw mounting it in the center of the speaker magnet. It's a pretty heavy epoxy type glue. Not exactly sure of the exact product that was used for that.

The Trim Grilles are the same for 66-67 with the same casting number. The only difference I could find between them was the style of rivet used to hold the Screen to the Grille. The Rivets are not visible once installed so they will work for either year. From what I know, the grille should be color keyed to the Interior Color.

The Speakers themselves also appear to be the same for 66-67 but they do have different engineering numbers ink stamped on the magnets.

[jwc66k]

Old Chinese saying - picture worth thousand words (hint).
Jim

[7Lscjracer]

Thanks for the info on the length which is hard to guess at from eBay pics.
I bet the thread is 10-24 since 8-32 seems a little light.
I doubt they're something wierd like 12-24, and 1/4-20 seems too heavy.
I'll see what the supplier has for fractional lengths around 1" in 10-24 thread.

[7Lscjracer]

I picked up eight 8-32, eight 10-32, and eight 10-24 machine screws all 1" overall length with a countersink domed phillips head in stainless steel.
They didn't have them available with the dog point.
Once I can check my speaker grills, it will be easy to tell the proper size by how they seat.
I expect these 3 varieties cover all the bases.
They're a hair shorter than originals described as between 1 1/16" and 1 1/8" long overall, but the next size available was 1 1/4" which is too long.
These 1" without a dog point have as much thread as an original though.

[7Lscjracer]

Ok, I got keen and waded thru my books and actually had success.
I found a drawing of the 66 Mustang door speakers install in the master parts catalog showing 50438-S for the screw.
I looked that up in the AMK guide to Ford fasteners 1955-73 and found it listed on page 44 as an oval head phillips 8-32 machine screw 1" long.
"S" means plain, so they're not chrome plated like I assumed.
Plain equals rust, so I'm happy to use stainless with the exposure they'll have in a door.
I'll have to epoxy some stainless 8-32 nuts onto the back of my replacement speakers unless I can find some original retainers with the "snout"
to hold them in place in the speaker frame.

[jwc66k]

That screw is a service part for a service speaker system, not a factory item. I'm not saying it won't work but I think the screws were "bonded" to the grill (or maybe slipped into a slot) and then pushed thru the four holes in the door into retainers in the speaker for installation. They were probably not visible from the outside the grill. And usually general use small hardware was clear zinc plated not plain, your stainless selection is fine.
Jim