Topic: Early 65 San Jose Fastback Trap Door Surround Panel Rivets or Screws?

[J_Speegle]

Another observation....................... In the examples the 7 always seem to be a consistent color or similarly aged too.  If these were added later, I would think we'd see some examples where 2 protectors would look newer in addition to the original 5 which would often be reused.

Also with all the different shops, owners, etc who would redo the interior on these, I would think there would be much more inconsistency in these protectors...I.e. there vs not there, 5 old 2 new looking, etc.

Point taken - we'll continue to search for even better - ( less played with examples to see what we can find. Should be able to put a fair number together

.........  Of course the Fastback only came out in Sep 64, so would be a short period

At least the production of fastbacks started then. We only have a few examples of the ones built before that period.   

One of the more unusual of the Sept ones I've seen was one with the cloth interior. Can't find anything that suggest that they could of been built that way - but there it was    Better not get off thread   

[birddog]

My San Jose fastback is Oct. 64. It had rivets around the trap door. Can't say for sure if they were factory or not.

[J_Speegle]

My San Jose fastback is Oct. 64. It had rivets around the trap door. Can't say for sure if they were factory or not.

Know we can't be sure but we can sure collect   so can we ask that everyone posting please include (modifying their original post would cut down on the clutter)  their cars projected build date from the door tag or VIN 

This might help track a change date or period if we can discover that the screw usage was original   

Birddog thanks for sharing and welcome to the site

[ChrisV289]

I haven't posted yet in the breakoff thread but decided to take pictures of mine and post.  Since the car has been in the family since 1992, we have never taken the back panels out.  I know the carpet was changed in the car prior to us getting it.  Build date on the tag is October 29, 1964 and was sold new on Nov 6.  Also Jeff, could you explain that black piece of cloth tape in the middle?  It does not appear to be doing anything.  The wire above is held by those clips...

[livetoride60]

Found this early 65 Dearborn Fastback at a local shop.  Build date probably Nov 64 or Dec 65.  No door tag, but sheet metal stamps I checked were 10/23/64 to 11/3/64, and steering box tag was and 11/5/64.

It has rivets in the lower two trap door holes on both sides, screws in the upper hole on each side.  Interior is trashed.  It's been siting since 1982.  The current owner found it as is in '82 in another junkyard, so possible the rivets are original.

[jwc66k]

Here's a couple more pictures of screws used on the trap door frame from a Sept 30, 1964 build, San Jose Fastback. More on this car later, just got access to it yesterday when I towed it to it's new home about 1 3/4 miles from the San Jose Assembly plant in Milpitas.
Jim

[ChrisV289]

Found it jeff

[ChrisV289]

Posted on Facebook for anyone who might have an unmolested interior SJ car built between august of 64 and December 64. The red car is actually 5R09K125001 when Jr shelby owned it (don?t know if that is his real name). First white car has a November 64 build date and the second white one is October 3, 1964. As I get more responses I?ll post.

[J_Speegle]

Just so the focus of the thread  does not just reflect the screw discussion I'll find time and post VINs and or pictures of examples that originally had rivets.

[ChrisV289]

Another interesting car on Facebook popped up. Same scheduled build date as mine. Appears very original. Carpet was the early style with no toe pad and vinyl on the rockers along with the rare cloth insert seats. Two of the plastic covers appear to have been replaced but are around the trap door. Also has the early squared off sill plates.

[J_Speegle]

Another interesting car on Facebook popped up. Same scheduled build date as mine. Appears very original. Carpet was the early style with no toe pad and vinyl on the rockers along with the rare cloth insert seats. Two of the plastic covers appear to have been replaced but are around the trap door. Also has the early squared off sill plates.

Interesting but it sure looks like some of those protectors were added later since they don't match the upper ones and don't appear to be the early opaque style

Just saying that I would think they would all match if done originally at San Jose especially since this and the others were late 64 built cars.

Trying to recall if rivets were used on any other parts of the car since if they were having issues with the supply side or the installation side we might expect it to show up in other areas

[jwc66k]

So, you want a "concourse grade" 1965-66 Mustang Fastback? The 65 and 66 Mustang Body Assembly Manuals both  say that 5 rivets are used around the trap door, but you got screws used there instead. So, who is "correct"? Do you have an assembly line "waver"? Do you have a TSB? Do you say - "I read that screws are used there." on some forum. - ? So, prove that screws are acceptable to the MCA.
I'll wait.
I'm not being a cynic. I have a 65 San Jose GT Fastback and a 66 San Jose GT Fastback in my garage.
Jim

[J_Speegle]

If I have this we so far have seen presented three or four examples from the same plant and same possible production period and a couple from about the same time and plant. Believe at this point we're all just sharing and "talking". Believe Chris is just following along with what we have practiced since the site opened. Having an open minded and fact based discussion is good for us and the history of these cars.

To further the discussion I would also be interested in how many fastbacks from same plant and period have the original rivets and how many fastbacks from through out the year turn up with screws. This might support that it was make due practice from earlier owners and "restorers" that choose screws over rivets.




Lots of possible rabbit trails that either go some where or don't    Won't know unless we chance them either privately or as a group

This is not to suggest that we have to chase every thread and every possibility but as we've suggested before. One car is just one car. Find  three - four - five unrestored examples from same plant and time with the same detail then it might be worth the time to check it out. Just an opinion and long held practice of some of us