Topic: How to tell the difference between original and a clone Hipo 4100 carb

[Dan Case]

I believe the carb tag should be FoMoCo not Autolite.

In my experiences Ford 2100/4100 carburetors mid 1962 into at least mid 1966 by date, and perhaps longer:

Carburetors sent to the engine assembly plant had tags marked with FoMoCo(R) logos.

Carburetors used in service departments or sold over the counter could have either the FoMoCo call out or some version of AUTOLITE(R) logo.



I have seen both FoMoCo and AUTOLITE tags as reproductions. I friend ordered a replacement tag for his 1964 carburetor and was sent one stamped AUTOLITE which was not correct assembly line wise.


As has been alluded to, buying any of the 1963?-1967 289 High Performance engine specific carburetors is a risk without verifying that what is offered is genuine, it has the correct cover, and it has correct auxiliary venturi.  Parts and cores have become so scarce in the market that buying an assembly with problems can mean years of hunting parts and lots of additional money spent to correct deficiencies. I have serviced HP289 carburetors for friends in many conditions from as found grime encrusted complete assemblies to "professionally restored" units missing correct choke parts, main fuel jets, cover assemblies, and worst of all original assembly tags (appearance) and auxiliary venturi assemblies (factory calibrated functions).  Correcting an ill assembled carburetor as purchased might require $200 to $800 in parts easily if you can find them.  Labor time goes up rapidly too sometimes.  I am in want of a C4OZ-9A523-B support (a.ka. M booster or auxiliary venturi assembly) for a C4OF-AT carburetor that has been apart on the bench two years next month. My friend just does not have it in him to buy another carburetor for potentially thousands of dollars just to get one part from it. (I have done that quite a bit for my play. I bought four C4OF-AL cores and a small collection of new old stock parts to complete one missing nothing assembly for one our cars. The left overs got sold as parts and not complete carburetors.)

Carburetor assembly dates that I have collected in my database for C4OF-9510-AL assemblies include so far:  4DE, 4FB, 4FE, 4GA, 4JA, 4KB, 4KC, 4KD, 5AD, and 5BB. The 5BB dated one is on the engine of an original owner car as of July 27, 2021 my notes indicate. Remember carburetor assembly dates were not the day the engine was assembled or the day the engine was installed into a new car. We have been researching implementation of this model for a car's recommission. At this time it seems probable, not proven, that the engine plant started using the C4OF-AL assembly in new engines ABOUT the third week of May 1964 and the first cars to get one of those engine were assembled  ABOUT the second week of June 1964. About is as close as we can get so far.  Engine assembly date is a very important data point for many engine parts as Ford made changes in many items every production year.


Many will know this but, Ford also appears to have repurposed either whole carburetors or just pre-made bodies into C5OF-L tagged carburetor assemblies. My data collection includes carburetors tagged as C5OF-L assemblies with C4OF-AL stamped on their bodies dated between 4GD (1964 July 4th Week) and 5CA (1965 March 1st Week) and there might be more dates to discover. Functionally , one can convert a C4OF-AL assembly to a C5OF-L assembly or vice versa pretty easily.

See also, related to the auction offered linked above in Reply 13:
https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?topic=26497.new#new

[Dan Case]

Hello all. I am restoring a '65 K code and I am looking for a genuine carb to complete the engine. I recently found a candidate on eBay, but I wanted to pass along the link to see if there were any red flags. The part on eBay looks legit from what I can tell, but I appreciate your expert advice.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/393977842362?epid=1428899235&hash=item5bbae8caba:g:i0oAAOSw0ftiJ-lE

Cam

Cam,
Be aware that many of the parts with a dichromate conversion coating (anything yellow gold so to speak) in the offered unit are much darker in color than the typical new Ford carburetor in period. The typical Ford 2100/4100 might have dichromated parts to as few as three to as many as six or more shades. Some small parts were just bright zinc originally or leached clear dichromated zinc. Earlier this year I separated parts for a single carburetor into several different levels of refinishing and they were refinished to match in batches. Because I had to send parts out to be custom refinished I made spreadsheets with color pictures of what colors levels I was after to go along with the parts.




Extra time and costs. It is much lower costs for rebuilders to finish all parts the same without regard to how typical parts were done by suppliers in the 1960s. No, finishes did not stay constant for years at a time or even batch to batch. If assembly line like appearance does not matter to a buyer so be it. If the buyer wants to take what they obtained and get it as close as possible to day one appearances all over, considerable additional time and expense can be involved.

Despite sellers of goods and services might say, most commercial work is more of set of practices to remanufacture something and not return it to as close as possible to day one specifications and norms in every way. Remanufacturing might be possible within a few hours while getting every part and finish as close as possible might take a week.
Dan