ConcoursMustang Forums
1st Generation 1964 1/2 - 1973 - Questions & general discussions that apply to a specific year => 1967 Mustang => Topic started by: V8_bloke_28 on June 02, 2016, 07:41:14 AM
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Hi
I'm in the process of painting my 67 mustang 390 San Jose grill and just need to know if the vertical supports and the "s" type bracket in the picture are to be argent colour or black?
Cheers
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I think that your questions are answered in this existing thread :
http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?topic=2267.msg11608#msg11608
Kind regards,
Jeroen
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Yep
Cheers
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I think that your questions are answered in this existing thread :
http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?topic=2267.msg11608#msg11608
Kind regards,
Jeroen
I had a look at this link, ok understood the alum mesh is not painted SGB but another colour, so where do I find a reference of what this colour looks like so we can match it ?
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NPD has it in "rattle cans", but they are frequently out of it.
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NPD has it in "rattle cans", but they are frequently out of it.
I'm guessing what NPD has that would be in the ballpark for a '67 is the '65 grille paint; that's the only color I can think of that is that blue/black color. I ordered a can of NPD's "correct" '67 grille paint a few weeks ago, and it ended up being Ford Argent.
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I have put my original '67 grill in the paint shop for scanning the correct used color code.
If it would be convenient for some people I will post the color code?
Kind regards,
Jeroen
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If it would be convenient for some people I will post the color code?
Yes Pls !! :)
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I'm guessing what NPD has that would be in the ballpark for a '67 is the '65 grille paint; that's the only color I can think of that is that blue/black color. I ordered a can of NPD's "correct" '67 grille paint a few weeks ago, and it ended up being Ford Argent.
Now that is scary. I waited several months until they had "the correct '67 Grill Paint" back in stock so I could get it. Of course their description is for the "correct metallic Blue". I already took it in March to our Colorado place (where my '67 is), but haven't done the grill yet. Obviously, when I get back there in a week or so, one of the first things I will do is try some from the can.
Thanks for the "heads up". I'll report back on what I find.
Bob
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.................. Obviously, when I get back there in a week or so, one of the first things I will do is try some from the can.
Thanks for the "heads up". I'll report back on what I find.
Please do with multiple (different lighting and angles) pictures to illustrate your findings.
Thanks
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Please do with multiple (different lighting and angles) pictures to illustrate your findings.
Thanks
First, before getting into my Reply, I should note that I had my Annual Eye Check-up in February, and I am not color blind, and in addition, at two weeks from turning 70, the only glasses I have are 1.75 Reading Glasses, and those only because my “35 sleeve length arms” aren’t long enough to read the small print.
That being said, here we go :
As drummingrocks felt that the 1967 Grill Paint that he had obtained from NPD looked like argent, I thought it would be a good idea to include “bar samples" of Argent along with the 1967 Grill Paint that I had finally gotten after waiting two months from NPD.
The first picture attached shows the paints I used. On the left, is Argent paint from Classic Auto Supply that I have used on my 1957 Thunderbird. I have compared it to some original Ford (not Motorcraft) Argent that I still have and the color is very good, but the Ford appears to have more metallic in it. In the middle is the 1967 Grill Paint, and on the right is Argent from NPD. Note that all are Seymour Paints, and most likely the two Argents are the same, but I have included both.
In the pictures that follow where all three “bar samples” are shown, the Classic Auto Supply Argent is always on the left, or on top, the 1967 Grill Paint in the middle, and the NPD Argent on the right, or bottom.
I think that it’s pretty obvious in the several pictures that I have included showing all three sample bars, that NPD’s 1967 Grill Paint isn’t even close to Argent. I think that either drummingrocks received a mislabeled can, or maybe it’s time for his Eye Check-up ??
The next nine pictures are of the 1967 Grill Paint sample bar only, in various positions and lighting (outdoor in shade, outdoor in sun, inside garage with ceiling fluorescent lighting and inside garage with the addition of a bench mounted fluorescent work light).
The final three pictures show the 1967 Grill Paint Sample Bar laid across my original grill, which as you can see, has most of the original paint missing.
In conclusion, I feel that NPD’s 1967 Mustang Grill Paint is very close to the original, based on the above. Also interesting is that this paint is very similar to the tutone Dark Gray Metallic Paint used on that Option (although I do not have a Grill Paint paint code to confirm that).
Hope this will be of help.
Bob
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I agree, that looks really close. I wonder if the guy who packed the box at NPD just grabbed the wrong can? What I received was labeled "Ford Argent," so I assumed that's what NPD was selling as the correct '67 grille paint. Good to know there is a usable alternative available!
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I agree, that looks really close. I wonder if the guy who packed the box at NPD just grabbed the wrong can? What I received was labeled "Ford Argent," so I assumed that's what NPD was selling as the correct '67 grille paint. Good to know there is a usable alternative available!
As of 6:30PM last night (on June 20, 2016), NPD is still out of stock (for last 3-4 weeks anyways) I called and rep said when it shows available online, they have it. Till then, I wait.
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First, before getting into my Reply, I should note that I had my Annual Eye Check-up in February, and I am not color blind, and in addition, at two weeks from turning 70, the only glasses I have are 1.75 Reading Glasses, and those only because my “35 sleeve length arms” aren’t long enough to read the small print.
Thanks for conducting a comparison test and posting the results.
Just what we like here - observations, opinions (with supporting findings) and pictures :)
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As of 6:30PM last night (on June 20, 2016), NPD is still out of stock (for last 3-4 weeks anyways) I called and rep said when it shows available online, they have it. Till then, I wait.
Thanks. Good to know.
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Original paint grills I remember seeing have a very definite bluish - green tint that I don't see in these sample pictures. Anyone else agree?
(The name "Dark Charcoal Metallic" doesn't convey that there is any blue-green in the mix)
If you save the attached picture to your picture gallery, then turn up the color saturation, you will see what I mean.
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Original paint grills I remember seeing have a very definite bluish - green tint that I don't see in these sample pictures. Anyone else agree?
(The name "Dark Charcoal Metallic" doesn't convey that there is any blue-green in the mix)
If you save the attached picture to your picture gallery, then turn up the color saturation, you will see what I mean.
What about the correct paint for a '65 grille? Seems like the '65 color that is currently offered is pretty close to the OEM color. Is a '67 that much different? Honest question--I've never had a chance to compare the two colors side by side.
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The 65 color is much more blue. I had a custom mix made from my old grill.
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Original paint grills I remember seeing have a very definite bluish - green tint that I don't see in these sample pictures. Anyone else agree?
(The name "Dark Charcoal Metallic" doesn't convey that there is any blue-green in the mix)
If you save the attached picture to your picture gallery, then turn up the color saturation, you will see what I mean.
Personally, IMHO, I wouldn't consider saying any of the original examples I have seen have a tint of green in them. Thought I also had an eye test a few months ago, we didn't test for color-blind. Last time I did test for colors (about 4 years ago), I passed perfectly (best of knowledge still in good shape)
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"Personally, IMHO, I wouldn't consider saying any of the original examples I have seen have a tint of green in them. Thought I also had an eye test a few months ago, we didn't test for color-blind. Last time I did test for colors (about 4 years ago), I passed perfectly (best of knowledge still in good shape)"
OK, I'll give you maybe no green but certainly bluish. Like Marty says, the 65 grill is much more blue and seems lighter in value.
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The 65 color is much more blue. I had a custom mix made from my old grill.
Did they give you any kind of code to reference? I might be able to have some locally mixed.
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The 65 color is much more blue. I had a custom mix made from my old grill.
I've been awaiting NPD to get the rattle-can paint back into stock for over a month now and if I knew for sure they WOULD eventually be getting it back into stock, I wouldn't need to ask about custom mixing this color.
I do have an original 67 grille that has never been tampered with yet and the original color is in fair condition. I'd say it represents the factory color very well. I will take it to my PPG store later this week and have it scanned. (we'll see what they come up with ;) )
I am also curious if Marty has a paint code as a base to work with. I've found there usually is a color "very close" but usually not "exact" when I've had items like this scanned in the past. It believe it would help to have a basic working starting point when having the color mixed (if a paint code were available).
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Gosh, you guys have got me interested in repainting my 67' grill! When I restored the car back in 1999 I painted it semigloss black because that's the color it was when i took it apart for the resto. Even though they look good, I am slowly redoing items on the car that were done incorrectly by me. I won't even attempt this until I have the paint in hand as a grill with fog lights is no walk in the park and i don't want to wait over a month for paint on back order with this tore all apart when I could be cruising! ;) Curious to here about the paint matching/code as i could get a small amount mixed locally as well. Really appreciate everyone's input on this.
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Here is a couple shots of the original color. I just received a couple of different rivets (nobody would confirm the correct sizes last week so I ordered both 1/8th" X 1/4" long & 1/8th " long tubular oval head steel zinc rivets (got 100 of each, how do I say OVERKILL?)
1/8th inch x 1/8th inch is correct.
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Richard,
When you are finished, I would be interested in seeing and hearing about the finished product...what worked and what didn't.
Thanks,
Mark
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Richard,
When you are finished, I would be interested in seeing and hearing about the finished product...what worked and what didn't.
Thanks,
Mark
Will do.
I was thinking about putting together a thread that might cross over several model years, a thread for a Do-it-Yourselfer Tubular Rivet system, something many of us possibly would like to do ourselves but do not want yet another expensive tool sitting around collecting rust.
Waiting on the anvil set for the 1/8" tubular rivets to get in (tomorrow I think)
Also need paint to repaint my grille mesh...may have to get it custom mixed
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NPD today saying the 67 grille charcoal Blue paint AP-GPC will be available after mid-July
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Richard,
When you are finished, I would be interested in seeing and hearing about the finished product...what worked and what didn't.
Thanks,
Mark
NPD today saying the 67 grille charcoal Blue paint AP-GPC will be available after mid-July
Here are some pics. My fabricated tool worked pretty good ;)
I might add some friction washers before using this on my refinished parts, (and lubricant) to keep the concave-die from spinning (the die could score adjoining painted surfaces while spinning with the threaded rod) Other than that "possible issue", I have no issues squeezing these steel, zinc plated 1/8" x 1/8" tubular rivets. Looks 99.9% factory to me :D
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Ingenious!!!
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Grill paint question - Anyone give the two listed in the FAQs a try?
Question 1b – My grill is in good shape but the plastic has faded. Is there a paint code I can use to freshen up the look for my car?
http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?topic=5.0 (http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?topic=5.0)
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Grill paint question - Anyone give the two listed in the FAQs a try?
Question 1b – My grill is in good shape but the plastic has faded. Is there a paint code I can use to freshen up the look for my car?
Jeff you might want to replace the word plastic with paint for 67-68 cars :)
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Grill paint question - Anyone give the two listed in the FAQs a try?
Question 1b – My grill is in good shape but the plastic (paint) has faded. Is there a paint code I can use to freshen up the look for my car?
http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?topic=5.0 (http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?topic=5.0)
Duplicolor 99-01106 is specified at this link...I cannot cross this to a current number in Parts store systems or online. Any updates?
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As promised...
Knowing that taking pictures isn't easy for to give back the correct color, but I can say it is very close...
I have asked to scan the paint from the grill at the bottom where there is an attachment with the stone guard.
At that place there was an overspray off white paint (for my car of course)...
so I assume that the correct (none faded away) color is located there??
For people overseas it is impossible to buy paint from US, so we have to do it our way :-[
Kind regards,
Jeroen
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As promised...
Knowing that taking pictures isn't easy for to give back the correct color, but I can say it is very close...
I have asked to scan the paint from the grill at the bottom where there is an attachment with the stone guard.
At that place there was an overspray off white paint (for my car of course)...
so I assume that the correct (none faded away) color is located there??
For people overseas it is impossible to buy paint from US, so we have to do it our way :-[
Kind regards,
Jeroen
I have the one grille of mine with original color at the paint shop now. He sent back a daub on top of the original (cleaned-up) color... my guy is color blind I think. ::) It looks a bit "purple", not the blue tinted charcoal of original.
The color codes Jeff shared (from the Library FAQ file), no dice on either.
Just got off the phone again with my color-blind mixologist...says he'll give it another try in the morning. If he cannot get closer, I'll just go to another paint store I suppose.
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Hello Richard,
What do you think of my color sample?
Can it help you to send you the color code mix?
or is there a difference between US and Europe?
Kind regards,
Jeroen
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Hello Richard,
What do you think of my color sample?
Can it help you to send you the color code mix?
or is there a difference between US and Europe?
Kind regards,
Jeroen
Looks OK through the monitor. I've not "sprayed" the sample mix the paint guy made up. Maybe it would look better sprayed (but I have my doubts)
Not sure if Belgium paint codes would help or not. Wouldn't hurt if you can get them though.
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BASF , being based in Germany, should cross to paint references here in the USA?? I think they were the manufacture of the "mystic" paint seen on mid 90's Cobra's and still hold the patent for that paint. I could be wrong....
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Is it correct that a NCS paint code is universal?
Or which code is common in the US?
I can allways ask my paint guy...
Jeroen
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That, I do not know... :(
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I was thinking about putting together a thread that might cross over several model years, a thread for a Do-it-Yourselfer Tubular Rivet system, something many of us possibly would like to do ourselves but do not want yet another expensive tool sitting around collecting rust.
That would be great to see. I saw your homemade tool for the ashtray, and I was wondering what kind of dies you used. It looks like the tool could have a lot of uses, including a grille like this one.
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That would be great to see. I saw your homemade tool for the ashtray, and I was wondering what kind of dies you used. It looks like the tool could have a lot of uses, including a grille like this one.
Dies: http://www.ebay.com/itm/181482608898?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
Rivets (100 count): http://www.ebay.com/itm/321495009710?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
I'm sure with a little shopping, better prices or a more appropriate quantity of rivets may be available. Before doing any "Library article, somebody could research this a bit more I suppose.
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I'm surprised to hear that you think NPD's paint is close to the original color. Periodically I speak with Scott Halseth from NPD (usually at Silver Springs show in January). Scott says he knows the grill paint color isn't correct, but can't get a manufacturer to make a run at it. This has been an ongoing discussion with Scott for a number of years. If Scott participates on this forum, maybe he can update us on the status?
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With a little digging I found my paint cans. The first is the 67 blue grey, the can says on top discontinued paint.
The second is the 68 HCS and GTCS grill and molding color.
Hope this helps you guys in some way.
Marty
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With a little digging I found my paint cans. The first is the 67 blue grey, the can says on top discontinued paint.
The second is the 68 HCS and GTCS grill and molding color.
Hope this helps you guys in some way.
Marty
Thanks :) I'll pass this onto my local paint mixer & see if they can locate a Cross Reference
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Please update the thread with your findings. I too would like to get some mixed.
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Nonetheless, I had a close match of the grille color made last week.
I assembled the brackets with my new tool.
I also added a 3/16" ball bearing under the concave riveting die so it would not spin the die while tightening the clamp. Without the ball bearing, I felt the "spinning" die would mar the rivet or adjoining painted surface. WITH the ball bearing, the die never spun, resulting in a perfect crimping of the rivet.
For what it is worth, I have a 2nd grille I will be assembling and the roughly 4oz. of paint my paint shop mixed last week, isn't enough left to spray the 2nd one...and I'm tired of hoping NPD will come through...it's been 2 months out of stock. (and who knows if the New Batch will even match)
The images I uploaded (below), it seems the top image looks closer to other images of unrestored that I have seen, the lower one is closer to what I see in person but is a bit darker than what I see in person. Camera flash was on in both instances.
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Here is a couple of pictures of the custom mix paint that I restored this grill with. Also in the picture is a sample of a bottom of a original grill and a spray out sample that I made for Richard. The color looks a bit different on the computer screen.
Marty
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Marty : As you noted, the computer screen can certainly make colors look different than in person; however, that being said, your samples appear very close to those that I sprayed from NPD's 1967 Grill Paint and posted in Reply #10. At least it's good to know that they are pretty close.
Bob
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One question I have: I know that colors can vary wildly from monitor to monitor. But what I'm seeing so far doesn't look that far off from Ford's Dark Argent. I used a can fairly recently to touch up a set of '66 hubcaps. If anything, the argent may have a bit less metallic in it, but other than that, it looks very similar to what I'm seeing pictured so far.
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it is much different than argent in my opinion. the grille has an obvious blue tint. argent is silver.
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it is much different than argent in my opinion. the grille has an obvious blue tint. argent is silver.
I agree, argent is silver. But Dark Argent is charcoal, and looks similar to what I'm seeing there. NPD sells both Argent and Dark Argent. Not trying to further muddy the waters, just thought that might be a workable solution for some until NPD gets the correct formula back in stock. I see a definite blue tint in some of the earlier pictures, but Marty's pictures look almost exactly like dark argent. I don't see any blue in the pictures he posted.
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I'll bring MM's picture back to this page. I imagine, it's all about the lighting, flash (camera) and screen resolution/settings. Like Bob did earlier, side-by-side helps but better side-by-side in person (not on a monitor)
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I'll bring MM's picture back to this page. I imagine, it's all about the lighting, flash (camera) and screen resolution/settings.
Yeah, I see what you're saying now. That is one crazy color. It almost reminds me of gun bluing. I don't think Dark Argent would be remotely close.
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A more accurate shot of my color mismatch. Maybe not perfect but some of the other earlier attempts of the paint store were far worse.
I plan on painting that second Grille which I used as a color guide also for a spare (maybe instead of?). Since I ran almost out of the other paint, I will likely use the sample Marty provided as a another form of attempting to match the color. More than 1 try cannot hurt ;)
Regardless, I am trying to come up with a paint code that we can ALL use with today's products, something that closest matches the original color. It shouldn't be this difficult to produce good match to something that would be acceptable.
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Hi,
I came across this NOS grille with manufacturing date 10/10/66.
Not like the usual service replacement parts, this grille has the right color and the brackets were riveted after the painting process. Nevertheless, the rivets are not bare metal but painted black like the brackets. The black paint on the rivets seems to peel off very easily.
Referring to the first picture in this thread about a 67 unrestored car, at first glance, the grille rivets seem to be black.
http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?topic=16444.0
Could it be that the grille rivets were originally black but lost there paint quickly after delivery?
regards
Laurent
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I have seen cars with the black rivets. I also have seen brown and of course the natural rivets. I do not deduct for any of them as long as they are not painted with the grill paint.
It is possible that some of the black rivets paint has peeled off. I sometime see all three colors on the same grill.
Congrats on the NOS grill find. It is beautiful. Nice to have a perfect example of the correct color.