Topic: 70 Dearborn radiator support seal photos needed

[Cobrajet428]

Does anyone (Jeff?) have photos of the radiator-to-hood seal installed on 1970 cars? My car is an October '69 build Dearborn '70 Mach 1 428CJ 4spd. I found just one photo here of a '70 car but that's a later car and used clips. I plan to use staples. The radiator support was replaced on this car so no clue as to what was originally there. I'd like to see where staples are placed, how the seal is aligned on the support, and how it is trimmed relative to the hood hold-down cutouts/plates. Thanks!

[rayms69]

Mine is dearborn built c-6 car 10-26-69, us
ed clips. So would love to see it both ways my mustangs friends,  sorry to jump your post

[SCJSTU]

my old 70 SCJ was built Nov 1969 but at Metuchen.....anyway here is a shot of staple holes on support......

not sure how to restaple the seal?

[J_Speegle]

70 radiator support seals have always IMHO been a difficult discussion (has taken place on other forums over the years) as there appears to be no real solid pattern and the use of clips has made it difficult to tell which cars received them

With that said I looked through the unrestored 70 Dearborn pictures I have and offer the following

Yes it appears that staples were at least used in the early months of production but the change date is impossible with the limited number of samples at this time


For Mach I applications it appears that the seal was cut at the edges of the hood lock supports like some plants did in 69

Hope these help in some way

stapled examples






Clip example





Mach I length example



Notice that two different styles of clips are shown

[Cobrajet428]

Jeff,

Those photos help immensely!

One thing of possible interest - I was told by Scott over at the CJ registry that the rear edge of the rubber is supposed to slide over the rear edge of the radiator support, which your first photo clearly shows. As well, when clips are used, in order for them to work the seal must be attached in this manner. However, over the weekend I looked through all the photos I could find online of stapled seals on original '68 and '69 cars and noticed that several that clearly showed the rear edge sticking up at an angle, not slid over the rear edge of the radiator support at all. It seemed as if the seal was simply laid down flat, seam between rolled-under rear edge and flat area aligned with rear edge of radiator support and then stapled. Have you noticed this? Do your photos from '68/'69 cars support or contradict this observation?

One more thing ... if I could actually get a hold of a set of clips I would just as soon avoid drilling the holes for staples. As you say, it could go either way in '70. Does anyone know a source for the clips?

[rayms69]

I found an nos set on ebay

[J_Speegle]

..............I looked through all the photos I could find online of stapled seals on original '68 and '69 cars and noticed that several that clearly showed the rear edge sticking up at an angle, not slid over the rear edge of the radiator support at all. It seemed as if the seal was simply laid down flat, seam between rolled-under rear edge and flat area aligned with rear edge of radiator support and then stapled. Have you noticed this? Do your photos from '68/'69 cars support or contradict this observation?

Bet allot of those pictures were of "restored cars"  Unless it was one car where a worker messed up the vast vast majority (can only recall one car) were installed as designed with the lip of the rubber seal seated over the rear lip of the radiator support

One more thing ................. As you say, it could go either way in '70...........

That is not what I was suggesting. Earlier cars like yours appear to have used staples only though the question is if your car even came with a seal. Guess you could make up a story suggesting that the staple machine may have been down when your car was built and the workers used clips instead - a theory used to explains some 69 examples that have been found using the clips where staples are considered the norm (that plant and year)

Glad we could be of help

[Cobrajet428]

Thanks for the clarification. Going forward with staples, with rear of seal slipped over rear edge of support. This part of the history of this car is forever lost to time.

[Cobrajet428]

Just a follow-up. Took a look at the '70 Osborn/Ford Assembly Manual again. Although the drawing is dated mid-October '69, superseding the '69 model year, there's some interesting discrepancies from what I've seen here and elsewhere in photos. Jeff, I know you like to remind people of the difference between engineering drawings and the ways these cars were made and here's a great example:

• Staples (item 'F') are shown inserted through middle of folded-over rear portion of seal. All examples of original cars I've seen have them inserted in or reasonably near the seam/line between the folded-over and flat portions of the seal.
• Staples are shown as "9 required". Typically I've seen 4. Not saying there might not be more, but 9?? I seriously doubt that was ever done.

Pasted-up excerpt from the manual for reference is attached:

[7Lscjracer]

One more thing ... if I could actually get a hold of a set of clips I would just as soon avoid drilling the holes for staples. As you say, it could go either way in '70. Does anyone know a source for the clips?

I'd recommend clips to save a lot of bother.
Doubtful it will ever be determined whether your car used staples or clips.
AMK sells them. They're just wiring harness clips.
http://www.amkproducts.com/bulk3.asp?part=B-10726
As in the 70 mach 1 pic, three clips are used since the strip is cut short to accommodate the twist locks, while the
69 mach 1 uses 5 since the strip is simply sliced partway to clearance the hood pins.
SJ uses a different style clip that I need 5 of BTW.
I have a used strip with staple holes stashed away.
GTG now, but I will try to get a pic this weekend if you're determined to go that route and need spacing and number of staples.
Can't remember what year mustang it came from, let alone plant, so that's something to bear in mind.

[Cobrajet428]

Thanks for the additional info, but I've installed the seal now using four staples which seemed about what I'd seen in photos up to this point. It's a pain drilling the holes and getting the right leverage to bend over the backside, but it's done now and looks good.

[specialed]

Moderator Note: The following posts were split from another thread focusing on 69 San Jose radiator seal clips


what about 70 Dearborn non mach1 428 cjs any pics of the seal in place as have had 3 70 Dearborn cj ragtops here & no staple holes but not sure about the seal with the clips?

[Bob Gaines]

what about 70 Dearborn non mach1 428 cjs any pics of the seal in place as have had 3 70 Dearborn cj ragtops here & no staple holes but not sure about the seal with the clips?

I have seen a few 69 Dearborn Mustangs and Shelby's with the clip that has the loop made into it for a wire. That would be my guess for Dearborn 70.

[specialed]

I am only talking about 70 Dearborn cj non mach 1s  having used the rubber seal from factory as still trying to doc that.   The reason I question that is Dearborn 69 b9s used the rubber seal but 70 b9s don't  & that's why I question the 70 cj non mach1s

[J_Speegle]

what about 70 Dearborn non mach1 428 cjs any pics of the seal in place as have had 3 70 Dearborn cj ragtops here & no staple holes but not sure about the seal with the clips?

Believe I do have some pictures -  but will split the topic since we're getting off track (imagine that